[a. Letter from the Zora Neale Hurston Florida Education Foundation sincerely thanking the City of Fort Pierce for participating in the 2024 Zora EXPERIENCE Festival, which greatly contributed to its success. ]

YOU FOR ALL THAT YOU DO. >> OKAY. WE HAVE RECEIVED A LETTER FROM ZORA NEALE HURSTON FLORIDA EDUCATION FOUNDATION FOR THINKING THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE FOR PARTICIPATING IN THE

[8. ADDITIONS OR DELETIONS TO AGENDA AND APPROVAL OF AGENDA]

2024 ZORA EXPERIENCE FESTIVAL, WHICH GREATLY CONTRIBUTED TO ITS SUCCESS. THEN WE MOVE ON TO ADDITIONS AND DELETIONS TO THE AGENDA AND THAT APPROVAL OF THE AGENDA.

>> ANY ADDITIONS OR DELETIONS? IF NOT, I TAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE. A MOTION IN A SECOND. CALL THE ROLL, PLEASE.

[11. CONSENT AGENDA]

>> WE WILL MOVE ON TO THE CONSENT AGENDA.

>> ANY ITEM THAT ANY COMMISSIONER WOULD LIKE TO PULL? I WILL ENTERTAIN A MOTION.

>> I MOVE FOR THE APPROVAL OF CONSENT.

>> EMOTION AND A SECOND. CALL THE ROLL, PLEASE.

[a. Legislative Hearing - Ordinance 23-058 - An ordinance by the City Commission of the City of Fort Pierce amending the city’s zoning atlas and establishing a zoning designation of planned development (PD) for three (3) parcels containing approximately 122.8 acres and being generally located at or near the northeast corner of Selvitz Road and Devine road and west of Christensen road in Fort Pierce, Florida; Subject property: Parcel ID(s): 2432-211-0006-000-3, 2432-211-0005-000-6, 2432-343-0001-000-4 - SECOND READING]

>> HEARING. ORDINANCE 23-058. AN ORDINANCE BY THE CITY COMMISSION OF THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE AMENDING THE CITY'S ZONING ATLAS AND ESTABLISHING A ZONING DESIGNATION OF PD PLANNED DEVELOPMENT FOR THREE PARCELS CONTAINING

[00:05:02]

APPROXIMATELY 122.8 ACRES AND BEING LOCATED AT OR NEAR THE NORTHEAST CORNER OF THE SOVIETS ROAD IN DEVINE ROAD AND WEST OF -- IN FORT PIERCE, FLORIDA. A SEVERABILITY CLAUSE -- AND PROVIDING FOR AN EFFECTIVE DATE.

>> THIS IS THE SECOND READING. ANYONE WISHING TO ADDRESS THE COMMISSION ON THIS ISSUE, PLEASE COME FORWARD. SEEING NO

[b. Legislative Hearing - Ordinance 24-015: Amending the Code of Ordinances of the City of Fort Pierce Chapter 125 - Zoning, Article IV - Basic Zoning Districts, Section 125-212 Planned Development Zone (PD) and deleting existing Section 125-213 CHAPTER 125-213 - Planned Unit Redevelopment Zone (PUR). FIRST READING. (Continued from May 6, 2024)]

MOVEMENTS, I WILL BRING IT BACK TO THE COMMISSION. IS THERE A

MOTION? >> MOTION TO APPROVE.

>> SECOND. >> A MOTION AND A SECOND. CALL

THE ROLL, PLEASE. >> 24-015. AMENDING THE CODE OF ORDINANCES OF THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE CHAPTER 125, ZONING ARTICLE FIVE, BASIC ZONING DISTRICTS. ZONING ARTICLE FOUR, BASIC ZONING DISTRICTS, SECTION 125-213. PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPMENT ZONE, P YOU ARE, PROVIDING FOR SEVERABILITY CLAUSE, REPEALING ORDINANCES OR PARTS THERE OF IN CONFLICT AND PROVIDING FOR AN EFFECTIVE DATE. THIS IS THE FIRST HEARING.

>> MAYOR, CITY COMMISSION. THIS ITEM RELATES TO AN AMENDMENT OF THE CODE OF ORDINANCES. SECTIONS 125, 212, AND 125-313.

THEY DEAL WITH PLANNED DEVELOPMENTS AND PLANNED UNIT DEVELOPMENT. SO THE PURPOSE OF THE PLANNED DEVELOPMENT ZONE IS TO PROVIDE A PROCESS FOR EVALUATION OF DEVELOPMENT IDEAS AND TRANSITIONS. IN ALTERNATIVE TO UNDERLYING ZONING AND THE PD DISTRICT. THIS IS A VOLUNTARY PROCESS. AND IT IS ASKS BY THE APPLICANT WHO COMES IN AND HAS AN IDEA THAT THEY HAVE A PROJECT THAT CAN ONLY WORK IF THE UNDERLYING ZONING WAS AMENDED SOMEHOW. BUT THIS ALLOWS THE CITY COMMISSION TO HAVE THE ULTIMATE AUTHORITY TO ACCEPT OR DENY WHAT THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING. SO THIS PROPOSED AMENDMENT SEEKS TO SET OUT STANDARDS FOR A FLEXIBLE PLAN DEVELOPMENT APPLICATION REVIEW AND APPROVAL PROCESS. NO CITY COMMISSION MAY BE AWARE, I THINK EVERYBODY IS AWARE OF THE ISSUES THAT WE FACED RECENTLY WHEN WE HAD APPLICATIONS FOR PLANNED DEVELOPMENT COME THROUGH AND THE SUBMITTALS ARE NOT MET WITH CITY CODE AS WRITTEN. THERE ARE SECTIONS OF THE CITY CODE WHICH ARE CONTRADICT THREE. THERE ARE SECTIONS OF CITY CODE WHICH PUT, REALLY, UNDUE BURDEN ON APPLICANTS WHEN THEY COME THROUGH THE DOOR TO HAVE A FULL APPLICATION PREPARED WHEN THIS IS, IN FACT, STARTING OUT AS A NEGOTIATION. BUT IF WE STAFF THE APPLICANT, THE PLANNING BOARD, AND THE CITY COMMISSION.

THAT NEGOTIATION IS BASED ON BOTH SIDES GETTING SOMETHING OUT OF THIS, AND THE COMMUNITY BENEFITING, AS A WHOLE, AND WHAT COMES FORWARD AND THE OUTCOME. IT ALLOWS DEVELOPERS TO COME UP WITH IDEAS THAT RELATE TO BOTH HOW THE COMMUNITY IS WORKING, COMMUNITY NEEDS, BUT ALSO TAKE ACCOUNT OF MARKET AND OTHER ECONOMIC CONCERNS THAT WE SEE IN THE CITY. SO THE PROPOSED AMENDMENTS RELATE TO THOSE TWO SECTIONS. WHICH IS THE PLANNING DEVELOPMENT ZONE. WHICH WILL BE AMENDED OR PROPOSED TO BE AMENDED TO INCORPORATE WHAT WE TITLED THE MASTER PLAN DEVELOPMENT, AND THE FINAL PLAN DEVELOPMENT PROCESS. WE ARE PROPOSING TO DELETE IN ENTIRETY OF SECTION 125-2153, THE PLANNED UNIT REDEVELOPMENT ZONE, THE P YOU ARE. AND WITHIN APPLICANT'S' OBSERVATION, A VERY CONFUSING SECTION. IT IS NOT CLEAR, IT REFERS TO SECTIONS OF THE CODE THAT DO NOT EXIST. THE SUBMITTAL REQUIREMENTS ARE DIFFERENT TO A PLANNED DEVELOPMENT. AND REALLY DO NOT EQUATE TO AN EFFICIENT WAY OF REVIEWING AN APPLICATION

[00:10:02]

FOR BOTH STAFF OR THE APPLICANT. THE NEW STANDARDS, WHICH WE WANT TO INCLUDE WITH THE PLAN DEVELOPMENT SUBMITTAL IS THAT THE PLANNED DEVELOPMENT SUBMITTAL ITSELF WILL NEED TO BE, FIRST OF ALL, MORE CONSISTENT WITH GOALS, OBJECTIVES OF THE POLICY PLAN. THERE IS NO WAY OF GETTING AROUND THAT. ALL APPLICATIONS THAT WE DEAL WITH COME TO THE BOARD HAVE TO DEAL WITH GOALS, OBJECTIVES, AND POLICIES OF THE CONFERENCE OF PLAN. AND ON TOP OF THAT, AND HE PLANNED DEVELOPMENT APPLICATION SHOULD INCLUDE A NUMBER OF BENEFIT THAT CAN BE EASILY DISCUSSED AND IDENTIFIED BOTH BY STAFF AND THE BOARDS, AND THE CITY COMMISSION. THESE SHOULD BE ITEMS WHICH CAN BE QUANTIFIED, QUALIFIED , AND SEEN AS, HOPEFULLY, A BENEFIT TO THE COMMUNITY. THESE WOULD INCLUDE A VARIETY OF NATURAL FEATURES, SCENIC AREAS, AND THAT COULD INCLUDE CLUED PUBLIC ACCESS TO AREAS OF THE DEVELOPMENT. SITE LAYOUT WHICH WOULD BE PLANNED IN AN EFFICIENT AND ECONOMICAL WAY. THAT WOULD BE LOOKING AT EXISTING TOPOGRAPHY OF THE SITE. TREES, AND TRYING TO PRESERVE NATURAL FEATURES.

INCORPORATE IMPROVED OR ADDITIONAL AMENITIES AND LANDSCAPING WITHIN THE PROPOSAL. ABOVE AND BEYOND THE CITY CODE. TO PROTECT ADJACENT AND EXISTING, AND FUTURE DEVELOPMENT. SO THIS IS LOOKING AT THE SITES, ITS LOCATION, WHAT IS HAPPENING THERE AT THE MOMENT, BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY, I THINK, IS TO LOOK AT WHAT THE FUTURE OF THAT AREA IS. TO PROVIDE SETBACKS THAT ARE CONSISTENT, COMPATIBLE, AND IN CHARACTER WITH ADJOINING PROPERTIES IN EXISTING OR APPROVED DEVELOPMENT. AGAIN, THAT IS LOOKING AT THE STATE OF DEVELOPMENT AND THE FORM OF THE CITY AS WE SEE IT AT THE MOMENT, AND IN THE FUTURE. TO LOOK AT INCORPORATING ADDITIONAL OPEN SPACE AS FAR AS POSSIBLE. AND THAT WOULD BE A MINIMUM REQUIREMENT THAT IS SET OUT IN THE CODE. QUITE IMPORTANTLY, I THINK STAFF ARE WORKING ON IT THIS AND WORKING THEIR WAY THROUGH IN GETTING BETTER QUALITY DESIGNS COMING INTO THE CITY. IS LOOKING AT THE ARCHITECTURAL DESIGN STANDARDS, WHICH IS ANOTHER PART OF THE CODE THAT THE STAFF ARE WORKING ON. AND THAT WILL BE COMING FORWARD TO THE CITY COMMISSION IN A FEW MONTHS. NOW THE PROPOSAL THAT WE ARE MOVING FORWARD WITH, HOPEFULLY, TODAY, IS TO SPLIT THIS PROCESS INTO TWO. CITY COMMISSION HAD IN FRONT OF THEM A NUMBER OF MONTHS BACK, PROPOSALS AND APPLICATIONS THAT CAME FORWARD AND SPOKE ABOUT A GLOBAL PLAN OR CONCEPTUAL IDEA, OR A SITE PLAN THAT WOULD BE PHASED IN THE FUTURE OR WHATEVER THAT WOULD BE. AND UNDER EXISTING CODE, THAT IS VERY DIFFICULT TO PUT IN A BOT AND UNDERSTAND WHAT STANDARD OF DOCUMENTS YOU SHOULD BE RECEIVING WITH THAT APPLICATION. SO WE ARE RECOMMENDING A SPLIT INTO THE PROCESS INTO TWO, WHICH WOULD BE IF THE APPLICANT WANTED TO, IT IS NOT MANDATORY OR REQUIRED, TO MOVE INTO A MASTER PLAN DEVELOPMENT, WHICH WOULD GIVE THEM AN IDEA OF STAFF, THE BOARDS, AND THE COMMISSION'S VIEWPOINT ON WHAT THEY ARE PROPOSING IN GENERAL. TO GIVE THEM A FOUNDATION, IF YOU WOULD LIKE, TO MOVE FORWARD IN A DIRECTION WITH STANDARDS SET AND REQUIREMENTS, EXPECTATIONS, AND CONDITIONS ATTACHED TO THAT, IN TERMS OF WHEN THEY WOULD COME FORWARD TO A FINAL PLAN DEVELOPMENT. ON APPROVAL OF THE MASTER PLAN DEVELOPMENT , THAT WOULD SET OUT THE CONCEPT. WE ARE NOT CALLING THINGS CONCEPTUAL, WE ARE NOT CALLING THINGS IN BUBBLES, WE ARE CALLING THEM MASTER PLAN DEVELOPMENT. ONCE THAT IS COMPLETED, YOU CAN SEE FROM THE LIST OF DRAWINGS OR SUBMITTAL ITEMS THAT WOULD BE REQUIRED, IT IS A FULLY LIMITED AT THIS POINT IN TIME, JUST TO GIVE THE APPLICANT, THE COMMUNITY, AND VARIOUS BOARDS AND ENTITIES AN IDEA THAT THEY ARE GOING IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION. ON THAT APPROVAL, THEY WOULD THEN MOVE INTO THE FINAL PLAN DEVELOPMENT SECTION, WHICH WOULD ESSENTIALLY INCLUDE EVERY SINGLE PART OF THE APPLICATION THAT YOU WOULD EXPECT WITH A

[00:15:01]

FINAL SITE PLAN. THAT WOULD BE DETAILED ENGINEERING PLANS OR CONCEPTUAL ENGINEERING PLANS, AS FAR AS THE SITE WORK TO BE DONE , PHASING, CONSTRUCTIONAL PLANS, ALL OF THE ANALYSIS OF THE TREES, TREE MITIGATION, A GOOD IDEA OF WHAT THE PROJECT WAS GOING TO BE ABOUT. ALL THE ITEMS THAT YOU WOULD SEE THAT WOULD BE RELEVANT TO A FINAL PLAN DEVELOPMENT PROCESS. AND THAT WOULD BE A VERY INTENSIVE SUBMITTAL PACKET, WHICH IS WHERE WE ARE TRYING TO SET SEPARATE THAT EXPENSE AND LEVEL OF REVIEW AWAY FROM THE MASTER PLAN DEVELOPMENT, SO WE CAN GET TO A POINT WHERE WE CAN ENCOURAGE DEVELOPMENT IN A WAY THAT THE CITIZENS, THE STAFF, THE BOARDS, AND THE COMMISSION HAVE CONTROL OVER THE DIRECTIN OF THE FINAL PLAN BEFORE THE WORK IS DONE, AND BEFORE, INSTEAD OF ENDING WITH A NEGOTIATION, WE END UP WITH CONFLICT, POTENTIALLY AT THE FINAL STAGE, WHERE THE APPLICANT HAS BECOME ENTRENCHED WITH AN IDEA BECAUSE THEY HAVE EXPENDED THEIR RESOURCES GETTING TO THAT POINT. SO THAT IS OUR REQUEST. AND SO ANY QUESTIONS, I WOULD BE OPEN TO RECEIVE THOSE.

>> COULD YOU GO BACK TO THE SECOND SLIDE, I THINK, WHERE YOU TALKED ABOUT WHAT WAS, NO, CONTINUE ON. WHAT SHOULD BE -- KEEP GOING. THIS ONE. IS THAT LANGUAGE GOING TO BE --

>> IN THE CODE? NO. >> IT WILL BE ACTUALLY IN THE

CODE? >> WE ARE STRIKING THESE DIRECTLY FROM THE CODE AS WE ARE PROPOSING. THERE ARE MORE THINGS IN THE CODE THAT I HAVE EXTRACTED AND THERE IS MORE ABILITY FOR STAFF AND BOARDS AND COMMISSION, AND THE CITIZENS, TO INFLUENCE WHAT IS ACTUALLY CONSISTS IN THE PD WHEN IT COMES FORWARD. THERE WAS A LOT OF INTERACTION. I AM REALLY GETTING BEHIND THIS FROM A STAFF POINT OF VIEW, BECAUSE WE ARE SEEING AND EXPERIENCING DIFFICULTY IN THE CITY ADDRESSING DEVELOPMENT THAT COMES THROUGH, THAT WE KNOW WOULD BE SUPPORTED, BUT WE DO NOT HAVE THE CODE UNDERLYING TO GET TO THE LEVEL OF APPROVAL THAT WE WOULD BE COMFORTABLE IN BRINGING IT FORWARD TO THE CITY COMMISSION, OR EVEN GETTING IT THROUGH LEGAL REVIEW, BECAUSE WE WOULD BE MISSING PIECES, OR NOT FULFILLING THE UNDERLYING ZONING. I AM PARTICULARLY THINKING OF ALL THE ISSUES THAT WE ARE FACING AT THE MOMENT WITH LINCOLN PARK, WITH THE SMALL LOTS. THIS IS NOT PARTICULARLY AIMED AT SMALL LOT, BUT IT IS A SIMILAR IDEA THAT WE WOULD BE MOVING FORWARD WITH WITH THE INTEGRATED RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT. IT IS RESPECTING THE COMPETENCE OF PLAN AND PUTTINGIN PLACE CODES AND PROCESSES THAT GET US TO THE POINT OF EVERYTHING THAT I HAVE HEARD FROM COMMISSION OVER THE LAST TWO YEARS THAT WE HAVE BEEN WORKING ON AND TRYING TO FIGURE OUT A WAY THAT WE COULD INTRODUCE ALL OF THESE THINGS.

WE HAVE MULTIPLE ORDINANCE COMING THROUGH WITH CODE CHANGES TO VARIOUS PARTS OF THE CODE, WHICH WILL LAYER ON TOP OF EACH OTHER. THIS IS ONE OF THE FIRST PIECES. IT IS ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT PIECES. AND IT IS A WAY OF RESPONDING TO CITY NEEDS AND MARKET NEEDS AND BALANCING THOSE TOGETHER.

>> IS THERE A CERTAIN AREA THAT IT IS CONFINED TO?

>> IT APPLIES TO THE WHOLE CITY. BUT WITHIN THE CRA, WE ARE LOWERING THE SITE AREA THAT COULD BE AFFECTED. YOU WILL SEE COMING UP ON THE AGENDA THAT A SMALL SITE WHERE WE HAVE APPLIED THE EXISTING PD, IT IS COMING IN THAT FULL SITE REVIEW AND THE EXISTING PLAN DEVELOPING STANDARDS, IT WILL COME IN, AND THAT IS THE SORT OF DEVELOPMENT THAT I WOULD BE WANTING TO ENCOURAGE FROM A STAFF POINT OF VIEW AND COMMUNITY POINT OF VIEW WITHIN THE CRA. WE ARE LOOKING AT SMALLER AREAS OF PD IN THE CRA AND FPR A. UNTIL WE GET THE UNDERLYING ZONING ESTABLISHED. AND THAT WILL BE MORE OF A TASK IN TERMS OF GETTING THE DOWNTOWN MASTER PLAN AND GETTING THE FORM CODE IN PLACE, LOOKING AT THE CRA ZONING PARTICULARLY. AREAS THAT WE NEED SMALLER LOT, ALL OF THOSE ITEMS WILL BE MOVING FORWARD, BUT THIS IS AN INTERESTING

[00:20:05]

POINT. BUT I THINK IT IS A GOOD DEMONSTRATION OF THE CITY MOVING INTO THE 21ST CENTURY AND UNDERSTANDING THAT WE DEPEND ON THE CITIZENS BEING ABLE TO ACCEPT AND TO HAVE A WORD IN WHAT WE DO, BUT ALSO HAVE THE MARKET COME IN AND DEMONSTRATE WHERE THAT MARKET WILL BE HEADING.

>> DO YOU MEAN BY PROTECT ADJACENT AND EXISTING FUTURE DEVELOPMENTS, IS A COMPATIBILITY?

>> IT WOULD RELATE TO THAT, YES. STAFF WOULD BE ASSESSING WHAT IS GOING ON IN THAT AREA. AND WE WOULD ALSO BE LOOKING AT WHEN WE NOTIFY RESIDENTS, WHAT SORT OF COMMENTS WE ARE GETTING BACK AND HOW THEY CAN BE INCORPORATED IN THE DISCUSSION ABOUT WHAT THE PLAN DEVELOPMENT NEEDS. FOR EXAMPLE, IF WE HAD A RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT CLOSE TO THE BOUNDARY OF A PLANT OF ELEMENTS COMING IN, WE HAVE A WAY, WE'VE ALREADY GOT IN THIS CODE A MINIMUM REQUIREMENT FOR A LANDSCAPE OFFER. AND A TREE PROVISION, WHICH IS HIGHER THAN CODE. THERE IS AN OPENING THERE TO SAY, HANG ON A MINUTE, WE HAVE RESIDENTIAL HERE. WE WANT A LARGER BUFFER. WE WANT ADDITIONAL LANDSCAPING TO BE PUT INTO THAT LOCATION. AND IT GIVES THE STAFF THAT INITIAL POINT OF DISCUSSION. AND THERE IS A DEGREE OF TRUST HERE BETWEEN WHAT THE STAFF WILL BE ASKING FOR AND WHAT IS COMING FORWARD. BUT WE ARE NOT HERE, STAFF IS NOT HERE TO SEE A DEGRADATION OF WHERE WE ARE AS A CITY. WE ARE HERE BECAUSE WE HAVE A PRIDE AND WE WANT TO SEE IT COME FORWARD. THIS IS A GOOD METHODOLOGY OF INTRODUCING SOME OF THOSE IMPROVEMENTS.

>> ANY OTHER COMMISSIONERS WITH COMMENTS?

>> CURTIS JOHNSON. >> THANK YOU FOR PUTTING THIS TOGETHER. WE WILL GO INTO A DIRECTION NOW TO TRY TO, IN MY MIND, MAKE SOMETHING SIMPLE, CLARIFY SOME THINGS, PUT IN LANGUAGE THAT PEOPLE CAN UNDERSTAND. SO AM I TO SURMISE FROM THIS THAT ONE ASPECT GIVES THE DIRECTION TO A PERSON THAT IS LOOKING TO EXPLORE DEVELOPMENT OF THEIR PROPERTY, A MASTER PD, SO I WILL JUST ADMIT UP FRONT THAT I DO NOT HAVE ANY TECHNICAL EXPERIENCE OF HOLDING COMMERCIAL ZONING, BUT I DO KNOW THAT YOU APPLY FOR PERMITS TO DRAFT AND ALL THAT STUFF. AS I LOOKED AT THE LIST, COULD YOU GO BACK THERE, PLEASE? CAN YOU GIVE A SENSE OF WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE? I KNOW THE FINAL PD IS NOT ALL OF THE REQUIREMENTS. THAT IS PROBABLY PRETTY EXPENSIVE TO GET ALL OF THAT STUFF DONE. BUT THE MASTER PD, WHAT IS THE DEGREE OF DIFFERENCE IN AN INVESTMENT

THERE? GENERALLY SPEAKING. >> IN TERMS OF A NUMBER? INAUDIBLE - OVERLAPPING SPEAKERS ]

>> COMMISSIONER JOHNSON MAY HAVE A BETTER IDEA OF THAT. AS A BALLPARK NUMBER, YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT TENS OF THOUSANDS FOR A MASTER, OR HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS FOR THE FINAL.

>> THAT IS WHAT I THOUGHT. I JUST WANTED TO GET A SENSE OF THAT TO MAKE SURE AUDIENCE UNDERSTAND IT. ALL OF THESE ARE INVESTMENTS IN THE COMMUNITY. AND WHAT WE ARE TRYING TO LOOK AT IS TO GIVE SOME SENSE OF THE PULSE OF WHAT YOU ARE TRYING TO DO. IS ITS OWN APPROPRIATE? THE PUBLIC CAN MAKE COMMENTS, ET CETERA. WITHOUT GOING TOO FAR INTO AN INVESTMENT, SPENDING HUNDRED HERE TO GET A POSSIBLE DENIAL, YOU CAN HAVE AN EARLY PULSE AND ATTEMPT AT THAT PRICE. IT GIVES EVEN US AN IDEA TO EVEN EVALUATE WHAT WILL BE GOING TO SPECIFIC

NEIGHBORHOODS. >> AN EARLY POINT OF CONTROL HERE BY ALL OF THESE ENTITIES TO GET IN AT THE MASTER PLAN STAGE AND SAY STOP, YOU ARE GOING IN THE WRONG DIRECTION.

LET'S PULL IT BACK AND REDIRECT. AND OTHER COMMENTS WOULD THEN COME FORWARD AND WE WOULD DELIVER IT TO THE

APPLICANT. >> THAT IS IT. THANK YOU FOR

THAT CLARIFICATION. >> COMMISSIONER BRODRICK?

>> THANK YOU FOR THE PRESENTATION, DIRECTOR FREEMAN.

I HAVE HAD THE OPPORTUNITY AS DIRECTOR AND CITY ATTORNEY TO REVIEW THIS IN GREAT DETAIL. AS YOU ARE AWARE, I SPENT MANY YEARS ON THE PLANNING BOARD AND WAS FRUSTRATED BY THE ANTIQUATED NATURE OF OUR ZONING. IT IS PROBLEMATIC. IT IS BURDENSOME AND NOT WORKABLE IN TODAY'S ENVIRONMENT. THERE ARE BUSINESSES THAT EXIST TODAY THAT WERE NOT CONFIDENT PLATED WHEN I WAS PUT TOGETHER. SIMPLY PUT, YOU CANNOT PUT THEM IN THESE ZONING CLASSIFICATIONS. SO, ALL MY YEARS ON THAT BOARD

[00:25:05]

AND COMING UP AS THE CITY COMMISSION, I WAS ALSO NOT A BIG FAN OF THE PUD OR P YOU ARE DEVELOPMENT SECTION OF THE CODE. I THOUGHT IT WAS CUMBERSOME AND ABUSED. YOU ARE RIGHT TO THE POINT ABOUT IT. THE PD PORTION OF THE CODE, I WAS TROUBLED WITH THE DIRECTION I SAW THAT GOING IN, WITH DOUBLE PLANS AND THINGS OF THIS NATURE. THAT WAS NONSENSICAL TO ME. OF COURSE, WE REVERSED DIRECTION ON THAT IMMEDIATELY.

DIRECTOR FREEMAN HAS TAKEN THE OPPORTUNITY TO ENLIGHTEN ME AS TO HOW THEY WANT TO UTILIZE THIS TOOL. AND HIS CONCLUSIONS I AGREE WITH 100%. WHAT IT DOES REQUIRE IS EXTENSIVE OVERSIGHT AND INPUT FROM THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT STAFF . HE AND I DISCUSSED THAT PARTICULAR ASPECT OF THIS. CANDIDLY, IF AN APPLICANT IS PUSHING A PLAN THAT IS NOT IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE CITY FROM THEIR PER SPEC OF, THEY ARE REQUIRED TO COME FORWARD WITH A NEGATIVE APPROVAL, OR TO NOT APPROVE TO THE CITY COMMISSION. I AGREE THAT THIS FIXES, IT IS A GLOBAL PERSPECTIVE OF FIXING THE UNDERLYING ZONING. BUT THE INEVITABLE QUESTION THAT I HAVE TO ASK WAS, WHAT ABOUT ABUSES TO THE SYSTEM? SOUTH BEACH IS A PERFECT EXAMPLE. I WILL COME IN AND BUILD 20 STORIES. IT IS NOT IN THE ZONING, NOT IN THE OVERLAY, IT IS NOWHERE ADDRESSED. IS IT IN THE BEST INTEREST OF SOUTH BEACH TO HAVE THAT DEVELOPMENT? IN MY OPINION, NO. SO HOW DO WE WRESTLE WITH THAT? I DIRECTED THAT QUESTION TO OUR CITY ATTORNEY. AND IN THAT QUASIJUDICIAL PROCESS, LOOKING AT THAT PLAN, I WANT THE ABILITY TO REJECT THAT PLAN BASED ON THE , WHAT WAS THE LANGUAGE? SORRY, I DO NOT RECALL OFFHAND.

>> HEALTH, WELFARE, AND SAFETY OF THE CITY AND ITS

CONSTITUENTS. >> CORRECT. WE HAVE FOCUSED ON THAT PORTION OF THE DISCUSSION TO SAY, I DO NOT WANT TO BE OUT HERE ON A WHIM SING WE ARE DENYING AN ALLOCATION IN THE CITY COMMISSION IS SUPPORTING THAT FROM THE PERSPECTIVE OF, WELL, WE DON'T HAVE THE AMMUNITION THAT WE NEED TO DO THAT BECAUSE IT IS A QUASIJUDICIAL PRINT PRECEDING.

SO, OUR ATTORNEY HAS ADDRESSED THAT ISSUE. SARAH, I AM SORRY.

MAYOR, YOU JUST USED THE TERM, ACTUALLY.

>> HEALTH, SAFETY, AND GENERAL WELFARE.

>> SP THE OTHER TERM YOU HAD USED IN OUR MEETING. IT IS ELUDING ME RIGHT NOW. COMPATIBILITY. THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT IT WAS. AND I HAVE USED THIS EXAMPLE MANY, MANY TIMES.

ESPECIALLY ON THE PLANNING BOARD. I NEVER BURDENED THE CITY COMMISSION WITH IT. BUT IN THE SHORT TERM RENTAL ARENA, A LEGITIMATING -- ELIMINATING ZONING REQUIREMENTS IN THAT PARTICULAR REGARD, I WILL NOT GET INTO THAT, BUT MY DISCUSSION POINT ON THAT, AND I'M GETTING SLIGHTLY INTO THE WEEDSHERE. COMMISSIONER GAINES, YOU ARE LOOKING AT ME, LIKE, MOVE ON. IT IS SIMPLY THAT IF I HAVE A R 2 ZONING CLASSIFICATION, I WANT TO MOVE MY DIESEL MECHANIC REPAIR SHOP THERE. UNDER THAT THEORY, THAT IS ALLOWED. SO UNDER THE PD THEORY OF THAT, TECHNICALLY, I COULD MAKE AN APPLICATION FOR THAT, BUT THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT IS GOING TO RECOMMEND NON-APPROVAL OF THAT. SO IF WE HAD THE PROTECTION, HAVING THE ABILITY TO DENY APPLICATIONS THAT ARE NOT IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE CITY BASED ON IT AS IT BODIES DELIBERATION, I WANT THAT FIREPOWER TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT. WE DISCUSSED THAT PORTION OF THIS AT LENGTH. THE ADVANTAGES TO THIS ARE MASSIVE. THEY SIMPLY ARE. AND ALL THE USES THAT WERE NOT IN THE ZONING ORDINANCE BASED ON WHEN IT WAS DRAFTED, WHAT? 40 YEARS AGO OR 50 YEARS AGO. THEY CANNOT BE BROUGHT FORWARD AS LOGICAL, VERY POSITIVE DEVELOPMENT FOR THE CITY AND BE ABLE TO GET APPROVAL WITHOUT BEING BURDENED BY ZONING CLASSIFICATION THAT DOES NOT SUPPORT OR EVEN COMPREHEND, OR CONTEMPLATE ITS USE. SO FROM THAT PERSPECTIVE, I SUPPORT DIRECTOR FREEMAN'S METHODOLOGY IN WHERE HE WANTS TO GO WITH THIS. BUT EVEN MORE FROM A DEPARTMENTAL SCENARIO, WE WERE ADDRESSING THE MECHANICS OF

[00:30:02]

THIS. IN THE MECHANICS OF THIS REQUIRE THAT STAFF REALLY DIG INTO THE MY NEW SHOW, REALLY DETERMINE BASED ON GLOBAL COMPATIBILITY WITH THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND WHAT IS GOING ON IN THAT GENERAL AREA. IS THIS IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE CITY ? WHICH ELEVATES OUR STAFF INPUT TO A CRITICAL PORTION OF THE DISCUSSION. SO WE DISCUSSED THAT ASPECT OF THIS AT LENGTH AS WELL. IF WE GET EARLY ON IN THIS PROCESS, BECAUSE THIS WOULD BE TESTED QUICKLY. AND WE FIND WE DO NOT HAVE ENOUGH FIREPOWER TO DO WHAT WE NEED TO DO AS A COMMISSION, THE CITY ATTORNEY AND I DISCUSSED METHODOLOGIES TO CORRECT THAT, BUT STILL KEEP THIS IN PLACE. SO THAT WAS MY TAKE AWAY OF IT. THIS IS VERY PROGRESSIVE THINKING. IT CAN BE A VERY POSITIVE TOOL FOR CITYWIDE DEVELOPMENT.

ESPECIALLY IN SOME OF THE OLDER NEIGHBORHOODS. AND REALLY, POTENTIALLY, BEAUTIFY SOME OF THIS DEVELOPMENT BY MOVING BUILDINGS CURBSIDE VERSUS PARKING IN THE REAR VERSUS PARKING LOTS IN THE FRONT. IT ADDRESSES ASPHALT JUNGLES. AND THEN YOU COMPARE THAT TO DELAWARE AVENUE WHERE ALL THE BUILDINGS ARE UP TO THE SIDEWALKS, NICE LAWNS AND LANDSCAPED AREAS. AND WE USE A COUPLE OF EXAMPLES OF THAT. AND THEN YOU IMMEDIATELY GET UP TO DELAWARE AVENUE AND YOU ARE BACK INTO THE ASPHALT JUNGLE. SO IT WAS A VERY UNIQUE DISCUSSION BECAUSE I REALLY HAD TO BE SOMEWHAT CONVINCED THAT WE WOULD BE ABLE TO USE THIS AS A TOOL, RELY ON OUR PLANNING DEPARTMENT TO BRING FORWARD QUALITY DEVELOPMENT , SCREEN OUT THE NONSENSE. AND IF THE NONSENSE ME TO FORWARD TO THE CITY COMMISSION, THEY WOULD COME IN WITH A RECOMMENDATION OF NON-APPROVAL. AND THAT IS THE DISCUSSION WE HAD AT LENGTH. SO, CITY ATTORNEY HEDGES, WOULD YOU JUST COMMENT BRIEFLY, IF YOU DO NOT MIND , ON THE RIGHTS OF THE CITY COMMISSION AND THE QUASIJUDICIAL PROCEDURES TO DENY APPLICATIONS THAT COME FORWARD? LET'S SAY AN APPLICATION COMES IN WITH A RECOMMENDATION OF NON-APPROVAL FROM THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT. CAN YOU JUST THEORIZE AS WE DISCUSSED IN A MEETING HOW THAT WOULD WORK? I JUST WANT TO BE SURE THAT EVERYONE UNDERSTANDS. WE HAVE A MECHANISM TO DO THIS.

BECAUSE YOU KNOW THE COMPLICATIONS WE GET INTO WIT THE QUASIJUDICIAL PROCEEDINGS.

>> META-MAYOR AND COMMISSIONERS, ALSO, IN SPEAKING WITH THE DIRECTOR FREEMAN, THE COMPATIBILITY WAS A DISCUSSION THAT WE HAD. IN SPEAKING WITH DIRECTOR FREEMAN, HE HAS EXPRESSED THAT IT IS HIS INTENT EXPRESSLY THAT THE PURPOSED SECTION OF THIS ORDINANCE , MOST OF WHAT YOU SEE ON HERE IS, MAYBE ALL OF IT, IS PULLED OUT OF THAT PURPOSE SECTION. BUT THAT IS TO INCLUDE COMPATIBILITY LANGUAGE THAT MAY BE MORE SPECIFIC IN THE CODE AS IT EXISTS CURRENTLY, BUT IN THE AMENDMENTS, COMPATIBILITY IS ADDRESSED WITHIN THESE ASPECTS. I THINK SPECIFICALLY HE POINTED TO APD SHOULD PROVIDE A VARIETY OF NATURAL FEATURES AND SCENIC AREAS, EFFICIENT AND ECONOMIC , ECONOMICAL LAND-USE, IMPROVED AMENITIES, ORDERLY AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, AND THE PROTECTION OF ADJACENT, EXISTING, AND FUTURE DEVELOPMENT. SO YOU HAVE COMPATIBILITY LIKE LANGUAGE THAT EXISTS THERE. IN DIRECTOR FREEMAN CAN COOPERATE THAT I AM CORRECT, THE INTENT OF HIS DRAFTING, THAT IS TO BE COMPATIBILITY. ADDITIONALLY, WITHIN THE CODE, JUST WITHIN CHAPTER 125, GENERAL REQUIREMENTS FOR ZONING THAT INCLUDE HEALTH, SAFETY, GENERAL WELFARE. SO IF THERE IS A PLANET DEVELOPMENT THAT IS BROUGHT FORWARD THAT DOES VIOLATES ANY OF THOSE RULES , IF STAFF IS RECOMMENDING DENIAL, THE DENIAL WOULD BE BASED ON THE CODE AND TYING IT BACK TO PROVISIONS OF OUR CODE THAT ARE BEING VIOLATED BY THAT PLAN DEVELOPMENT.

>> BASED ON THOSE STIPULATIONS, I FEEL COMFORTABLE THAT THIS IS A PROGRESSIVE CONCEPT THAT CAN BE DEPLOYED. IF NEED BE, IT IS A WORKING DOCUMENT. THIS IS THE FIRST EDITION OF THIS. AND IF REVISIONS ARE NEEDED, I WILL BE THE FIRST ONE TO SUGGEST THAT REVISIONS NEED TO BE MADE. BUT I BELIEVE THAT AT THE OUTSET HERE , I THINK THIS IS A VERY, VERY POSITIVE MOVE FOR DEVELOPMENT WITHIN THE CITY. AND I AM LOOKING FORWARD TO TESTING THE WATERS WITH THIS. AS I SAID IN OUR MEETING, WE WILL ALL COME TO THE SAME CONCLUSION IF REVISIONS ARE NEEDED . I BELIEVE THAT TO BE THE CASE. I BELIEVE SO. SO I AM ADVOCATING THIS WITH ALL MY YEARS ON THE PLANNING BOARD. I HAVE SEEN ALL THE PROBLEMS THAT EXISTED BECAUSE OF OUR ZONING.

THIS IS A SOLUTION. IT IS A GLOBAL SOLUTION TO THAT WITH

[00:35:03]

PROTECTIONS THAT I BELIEVE WE NEED TO HAVE ON HAND. SO, COMMISSIONER GAINES, I KNOW HE IS GETTING GEARED UP DOWN THERE. HIS REBUTTAL TO THIS WILL BE --

>> NO, NO. >> YOU WANT TO GO NEXT?

>> I NEVER THOUGHT I WOULD HEAR THE WORD BUBBLE, BUBBLE SCREEN, BUT WILL PLAN, WHATEVER IT IS, AGAIN. DIRECTOR FREEMAN, THANK YOU FOR YOUR PRESENTATION. THIS IS SOMETHING THAT WE ASKED YOU TO DO BECAUSE OF WHATEVER THE TERM WAS WHEN IT CAME UP. AND NO ONE KNEW WHAT IT WAS. BUT JUST TO GO TO YOUR POINTS, COMMISSIONER BRODERICK, EVERYTHING I HAVE READ BEFORE TONIGHT WHEN WE GOT THIS PACKAGE, REGARDLESS OF WHAT STAFF DOES, AND RECOMMENDATIONS TO ACCEPT OR NOT ACCEPT, IT IS ALWAYS THOSE THREE OPTIONS. THEY CAN ACCEPT, EXCEPT WITH CHANGES OR RECOMMENDATIONS, OR DISAPPROVAL. AND I DO NOT SEE ANYTHING, I DID NOT READ ANYTHING, AND I AM ASKING NOW, IN CASE I FELL ASLEEP AND WOKE BACK UP READING THE OTHER SECTION, THAT IS NOT CHANGING BASED ON THIS AMENDMENT. AT THE END OF THE DAY, WHEN THEY COME BEFORE US, WE HAVE THREE OPTIONS. REGARDLESS OF WHAT THE STAFF DOES, WE HAVE THREE OPTIONS. WE CAN APPROVE WITH STAFF RECOMMENDATIONS, WE CAN APPROVE WITH OUR RECOMMENDATIONS, OR WE CAN DISAPPROVE. AS LONG AS THAT HAS NOT CHANGED, AND I UNDERSTAND THAT IF WE DISAPPROVE, I KNOW. IF WE DISAPPROVE AND IT IS IN A QUASIJUDICIAL PART OF THE MEETING, IF WE DISAPPROVE IT, YOU HAVE TO STATE WHY YOU DISAPPROVE IT ON THE RECORD BASED ON THE CODE. JUST BECAUSE YOU MIGHT NOT WANT A 20 STORY BUILDING ON SOUTH BEACH, DURING THAT LEGISLATIVE HEARING OR JUDICIAL HEARING, YOU CANNOT SAY IT THAT WAY. YOU HAVE TO SAY IT BASED ON WHAT OUR CODE SAYS. SO I DO NOT SEE ANYTHING, I DID NOT SEE ANYTHING TAKING THE ABILITY FROM US TO MAKE THE FINAL DECISION. AND YOU ARE NOT ASKING THAT, RIGHT? THE FINAL

DECISION COMES TO US. NO, YES? >> META-MAYOR AND COMMISSIONERS, I WAS GOING TO SAY, YES, THE PROCESS WOULD STILL BE THE SAME. AT THE END OF THE DAY, STEPH MAKES A RECOMMENDATION, YOU MAKE YOUR DECISION BASED ON COMPETENCE AND CIRCUMSTANTIAL EVIDENCE. THAT DOES NOT CHANGE.

>> I JUST WANT TO BE CLEAR ON THAT. I WAS HEARING, I DID NOT READ ANYTHING BEFORE I GOT HERE TONIGHT THAT SAID IT DOES NOT STOP HERE. SO IT TAKES A VOTE UP HERE FOR US TO APPROVE WHATEVER STAFF SAYS THEY LIKE OR DISLIKE, IT STILL STOPS HERE. I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE, ON THE RECORD, THAT IT IS

CLEAR. >> THAT IS CLEAR, IT IS THE

TRUTH, YES. >> I WOULD LIKE TO REPHRASE AND QUALIFY LITTLE BIT. IT IS THE STAFF APPLET PATIENT AS WELL.

IT IS NOT JUST STAFF, IT IS THE APPLICATION YOU RECEIVE AN INFORMATION RECEIVED DURING THE HEARING PEERS MAKE EVERYBODY COMES UP AND MAKES HER 20 MINUTES. WHEN THE MADAME MAYOR READS A HAVE FIVE MINUTES TO COME BACK AND ANSWER THIS QUESTION, AND ALL THOSE TIMES, WHEN EVERYBODY SITS DOWN AND SHE LOOKS AT US AND SAYS, OKAY, BOARD, WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO? AT THAT POINT, IT IS THE FIVE OF US UP HERE THAT MAKES THE FINAL DECISION. NOTHING IN THIS AMENDMENT CHANGES THAT.

>> CORRECT. >> THANK YOU.

>> FOR CLARIFICATION, IF YOU DO THE MASTER PLAN, THAT GOES TO THE PLANNING BOARD THAN COMMISSION ALSO? AND IF YOU GO TO THE FINAL PLAN, IT GOES THE SAME ROUTE TOO. SO, REALLY, IF YOU WENT THROUGH THAT INITIAL STEP , YOU HAVE MORE STEPS. YOU STILL HAVE TO COME BACK WITH A FINAL.

>> COME BACK THROUGH STAFF, THE PLANNING BOARD, AND YOU HAVE TO COME BACK TO THE CITY COMMISSION.

>> AND IF YOU HAVE THE INITIAL STAFF, WHAT IS THAT CALLED? MASTER PLAN? IF YOU HAVE THAT AND THE COMMISSION WAYS IN AND SAYS WE WANT YOU TO DO X, Y, Z, AND GIVES A LOT OF DIRECTION AND THEY GO AWAY AND DO XYZ, ARE WE OBLIGATED AT THAT TIME?

>> THEY NEED TO COME BACK AND DEMONSTRATE THEY HAVE DONE THAT. THERE IS NO OBLIGATION AT ANY POINT THAT YOU HAVE COMMITTED TO APPROVING THE FINAL PD. BUT YOU DO HAVE, AND THE APPLICANT HAS A ROAD MAP TO GET TO A POINT WHERE THEY WOULD SEE MORE POSITIVE THAN NEGATIVE. THE COMPANIES THAT APPLICATION WITH ALL THE REQUEST THAT THE CITY

[00:40:02]

COMMISSION -- >> I WOULD NOT WANT IT TO BE THAT IF THEY, IF WE APPROVE THE MASTER PLAN, THAT AUTOMATICALLY MEANS THAT WHEN THEY COME BACK, THEY GET APPROVAL. WE STILL

HAVE THAT ABILITY? >> ABSOLUTELY, YES.

>> DOES ANYONE ELSE WANT TO TALK?

>> YOU GO TO THE MASTER PLAN, YOU HAVE THE APPROVAL ON THE FINAL. WHAT IS THE EXPECTATION OF THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT FOR THE APPLICANT AS FAR AS TIMING? IS THERE ONE?

>> TIMING IS ALWAYS SET THROUGH PRIMARILY THE REQUIREMENTS FOR NOTIFICATION. THIS FOLLOWS THE SAME NOTIFICATION, WHATEVER ROUTE YOU TAKE FROM MASTER TO FINAL, PUBLIC IDENTIFICATION, REQUIRED NOTIFICATION FOR THE PLANNING BOARD, CITY COMMISSION. AND THEN YOU HAVE THE TECHNICALREVIEW COMMITTEE TO START WITH. SO USUALLY, WE ARE TALKING, YOU KNOW, THE SAME PROCESS TIMELINE FOR MASTER AND FINAL, EVEN THOUGH THE REVIEW TIME FOR FINAL MAY BE A LITTLE BIT MORE DETAILED. SO I THINK FOR EITHER, YOU ARE TALKING BETWEEN FOUR AND SIX MONTHS EACH, DEPENDING ON THE CALENDAR AND WHERE THE MEETINGS FALL, AND THE COMPLEXITY OF THE SUBMITTAL AND THE ACCURACY OF THE PLANS THAT ARE SUBMITTED WITH THE SUBMITTAL AND THEY DO NOT NEED REVISING THROUGH CERTAIN REQUIREMENTS OF CODE THAT WE HAVE ALREADY. THE BENEFIT TO THE APPLICANT THAT THIS BRINGS IS THAT A LOT OF THE HEAVY LIFT WORK IS DONE TO THE FINAL IN TERMS OF PREPARATION OF INFORMATION, ARCHITECTURAL DRAWINGS, ACTUAL LANDSCAPE PLANS, TREE SERVICE, ALL OF THAT. THEY COULD STILL BRING THEM WITH THE MASTER PLAN AND GET THEM LOOKED AT, AT THAT STAGE. BUT ULTIMATELY, THEY WOULD NOT GET ANY APPROVAL TO ACTUALLY GO TO A BUILDING PERMIT UNTIL THEY HAVE THE FINAL PLAN DEVELOPMENT.

>> IN YOUR EXPERIENCE DURING THE MASTER REVIEW PHASE, WHEN STAFF IS LOOKING AT THIS WITH THE APPLICANT, MAKING COMMENTS, BEFORE IT EVEN GOES TO PLAN OR THE CITY COMMISSION. IS IT AN OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE GENERAL CONVERSATION ABOUT THE LANDSCAPE PLAN AND ABOUT THE OTHER ELEMENTS REQUIRED IN THE FINAL JUST SO THEY HAVE A GOOD IDEA OF WHAT TO EXPECT, WHERE TO BE LIMIT COME IN FOR FINAL, BUT NOT NECESSARILY SUBMIT THE

PLAN? >> WE ARE SAYING THESE ARE THE MINIMUM REQUIREMENTS YOU WOULD PUT IN. YOU KNOW, AS WE CONCEPTUALIZED A MOMENT AGO ABOUT HAVING A RESIDENTIAL CLOSE TO A COMMERCIAL PD, WHAT WOULD WE BE EXPECTING FOR BUFFERS? WHAT WOULD WE BE EXPECTING FOR LANDSCAPING? IN THAT AREA TO MITIGATE THE IMPACT OR ANY POTENTIAL IMPACT OF THE PROPOSED USE. CONVERSELY, IF WE HAD A RESIDENTIAL COMING IN AGAIN INDUSTRIAL OR WHATEVER THAT WOULD BE, WHAT WOULD BE THE MEASURES THAT WOULD BE NEEDED TO BE IMPLEMENTED INTO THE PLAN DEVELOPMENT TO ADDRESS THE DISTURBANCE THAT THEY COULD EXPERIENCE FROM EXTERNAL USES.

SO IT WORKS BOTH WAYS. >> AND IF I HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO SUBMIT MY PLANS, I AM GOOD, I PAID FOR ALL OF MY DRAWINGS , ALL OF THE PARTS OF THE CODE THAT ARE REQUIRED, I

CAN GO DIRECTLY TO FINAL? >> YOU CAN GO TO FINAL. IT IS MORE OF AN AT RISK SITUATION BECAUSE YOU HAVE ALREADY PAID AND YOU HAVE CEMENTED A FOUNDATION FOR WHAT YOU WILL BE ASKING FOR. THAT DOES NOT PREVENT STAFF OR BOARDS REDIRECTING THAT EFFORT. AND THAT CAUSES RELUCTANCE OF THAT INVESTMENT INTO A PROPERTY IF, YOU KNOW , YOU ARE GETTING 100% THROUGH THE PROCESS AND STILL NOT GETTING TO THE POINT WHERE EVERYBODY IS AGREEING ON STUFF.

>> OKAY. I THINK THOSE WERE THE PRIMARIES I WANTED TO COVER. I AGREE WITH MY FELLOW COMMISSIONERS AND MAYOR. IT IS A UNIQUE PROCESS, WITHOUT A DOUBT. SO WITHOUT JUST GOING THROUGH THE STANDARD PORTIONS OF THE CODE AS FAR AS THE UNDERLYING ZONING OF THE ACTUAL ZONING, THERE JUST IS NO CHANCE FOR INNOVATION. THERE IS AND THERE IS NOT. THERE ARE MINIMUMS. IT IS EASY JUST TO MEET THE MINIMUMS. WHEN WE HAVE THIS OPPORTUNITY, LOOKING AT DEVELOPMENT APPLICATIONS, THERE IS OPPORTUNITY TO, LIKE YOU SAID, MITIGATE CIRCUMSTANCES.

WHETHER IT BE LANDSCAPE, BUFFERS, YOU KNOW, IT COULD BE

[00:45:06]

TRAFFIC. WHATEVER IT MIGHT BE. THERE ARE SO MANY PARAMETERS WHERE WE CAN LOOK TO THE DEVELOPMENT COMMUNITY TO HANDLE THE SITUATION. RATHER THAN THE PUBLIC . RATHER THAN THE CITY JUST GETTING AN APPLICATION AND, SORRY, YOU ARE R 2. THIS IS HOW MANY UNITS I AM ALLOWED PER ACRE AND THAT IS THE END OF THE STORY. IN ADDITION TO THAT, IN MY LAST COMMENT WILL BE THAT I BELIEVE THAT, AND I AM EXPERIENCING WITHIN THESE WALLS AND EVEN OUTSIDE OF THESE WALLS, THE PRESSURE TO DEVELOP FORT PIERCE. AND IT IS HERE. I KNOW YOU SEE IT IN YOUR OFFICE.

SO WE HAVE TO BE VERY, WHAT IS THE WORD? I GUESS, I DON'T KNOW, INSIGHTFUL, I GUESS. WHAT WE SEE COMING, WHAT THERE MIGHT BE, AND HOW DO WE PLAN AHEAD FOR THE NEXT 15? IT IS THE FIVE-YEAR, THE 15, THE 25, AND 45 YEAR PLANNING.. SO, 20 YEARS FROM NOW WHEN SOMEONE IS LOOKING BACK AT THE MEETING MINUTES AND WHEN THE EDITS WERE MADE IN THIS ORDINANCE SECTION, WILL THERE BE ANY QUESTIONS THAT YOU CAN THINK OR COME UP

WITH? >> THE FIRST QUESTION IS, WHERE IS THIS GUY WORKING NOW? BECAUSE WE NEED HIM.

] BUT I THINK WHAT PEOPLE HOPE THE VISION THAT WE HAVE IN THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT, EDITING THE WHOLE CITY, IS TO SEE A VIBRANT CITY COMING THROUGH. IN THE FORM OF THAT CITY BASED ON ITS OWN IDENTITY. AND THIS IS A WAY TO CONSOLIDATE THAT IDENTITY. BECAUSE WE HAVE A PROCESS THAT IS NOT ONLY REGULATORY, WE HAVE A PROCESS THAT ENCOURAGES INPUT AND REDEFINING STANDARD. AND OTHER PIECES OF THE CODE THAT YOU WILL NOT BE SEEING, WE GOT THROUGH A LOT OF DRAFTING WHERE THE PIECES ALL WILL FIT INTO THIS. WHAT WE ARE EXPECTING FOR A MINIMUM ARCHITECTURAL STANDARD, WHAT ARE WE EXPECTING FOR A MINIMUM LANDSCAPE STANDARD? WHAT OTHER THINGS THAT WE NEED FROM A TRANSPORTATION POINT OF VIEW, RECENTLY, THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT HAS RECENTLY HAD SUBSTANTIAL MEETINGS WITH THE TPO STAFF, THE COUNTY STAFF, F D.O.T., LOOKING AT HOW WE ADDRESS OUR TRANSPORTATION ISSUES AND ROADWAYS. ALL OF THOSE THINGS ARE MORE EASILY INCORPORATED INTO THIS KIND OF PROCESS. THOSE ENTITIES GET TO INPUT IN THIS PROCESS AND WE CAN THEN REGULATE THOSE. YOU WILL SEE AGAIN WITH PLANNING APPLICATIONS COMING FORWARD WITH LAND DEVELOPMENT COMING FORWARD, COMMENTS FROM THE COUNTY, COMMENTS FROM THE TPO. COMMENTS FROM PORT ST. LUCIE IN TERMS OF THEIR ROADWAY SYSTEMS AND HOW THESE DEVELOPERS ARE AFFECTING THEIR ROADWAY SYSTEMS. AND WHAT CAN WE DO TO ASSIST THEM? THAT WILL BE A TWO-WAY PROCESS. WHAT CAN THEY

DO TO ASSIST US? >> THINK YOU. OTHER QUESTIONS? ANYBODY? WE ARE GOOD? THIS IS A PUBLIC HEARING. ANYONE WISHING TO ADDRESS THIS ISSUE, PLEASE COME FORWARD. SEEING NO ONE --

OH, OKAY. >> CHRIS EINSTEIN. 207 ORANGE AVENUE. WE HAVE BEEN HERE BEFORE. WE ARE DEFINITELY FOR THE MASTER PLAN. MAIN .2 PLEASE KEEP IN MIND IS THAT WITH THE MASTER PD, THE APPLICANT CANNOT PUT A SHOVEL IN THE GROUND UNTIL THEIR FINAL PD IS APPROVED. THE FINAL PD WILL COME FROM THE COMMISSIONERS. YOU HAVE FINAL SAY, YOU WILL SEE WHAT THE APPLICANT PLANS TO DO. THE MASTER PD ALLOWS THE APPLICANT TO DIP THEIR TOES IN THE WATER TO SEE IF A CONCEPT OR DESIGN IS COHESIVE. THE CITY'S COPPERHEADS OF PLAN, THE OVERALL AESTHETICS, AND THE NEIGHBORS CAN WEIGH IN BEFORE INVESTING, LIKE KEVIN SAID, 50,000, $200,000 PLUS . I'M EMBARRASSED TO SAY HOW MUCH WE ARE UP TO DUE TO THE SETBACKS WE HAVE HAD, UNFORESEEN SETBACKS THAT WERE NOT EVEN DO TO US. IT WAS FORMER CITY EMPLOYEES IN THE COPPERHEADS OF PLAN EXPIRING. BUT THAT IS NEITHER HERE NOR THERE, JUST TRYING TO MOVE FORWARD WITH THIS. BUT THESE THINGS KEEP HAPPENING. AND IF THERE IS A HUGE DIFFERENCE IN COST. IF WE

[00:50:03]

COULD JUST PUT IN THE MASTER PLAN OR JUST, HEY, LET'S WORK TOGETHER. HERE'S WHAT OUR VISION IS. DO YOU LIKE THIS OR NOT LIKE IT? RE: ALL TOGETHER ON THIS? THAT IS ONE THING.

WHEN YOU HAVE TO COME IN FOR THE FINAL PLANS, OR EVEN IF YOU ARE REQUIRING A LANDSCAPE PLAN AND THEN YOU GO BACK AND YOU DO NOT LIKE WHERE THE BUILDING IS OR THIS OR THAT, YOU ARE STARTING ENTIRELY OVER AGAIN. WE ARE VERY MUCH FOR THIS PROJECT. WE HAD TO READ PLANS MULTIPLE TIMES, AND WE ONLY HAVE TWO ACRES AND A SMALL PROJECT. I DO NOT EVEN KNOW HOW MUCH SOME OF THESE LARGER DEVELOPERS OF HAD AND HOW MUCH THEY HAVE INVESTED AND WASTED IN PLANS BEING SET BACK OR NEEDING TO DO A CHANGE. WE HAVE BEEN WAITING SINCE I TOBER 16TH OF 2023 FOR THIS PD ORDINANCE TO BE UPDATED. YOU KNOW? AND WE ARE NOT THE ONLY ONES. THE OUTDATED CODE IS PREVENTING OVERALL DEVELOPMENT. THE CITY CODE IS IN CONFLICT WITH ITSELF IN THE STATE STATUTES. THE MASTER PD WILL HELP FIX THIS UNTIL THE CITY HAS TIME TO UPDATE ITS ENTIRE CODE. IT IS ANTIQUATED. IN THE CITY SHOULD BE LOOKING AT SENDING THAT OUT TO AN OUTSIDE COUNSEL TO UPDATE IT TO BRING US INTO THE 21ST CENTURY. WE SPENT ALL THESE MONIES ON DIFFERENT SURVEYS AND OUTSOURCING ITEMS, BUT THE MAIN PART OF THE CODE AND UPDATING THE CODE SO THAT WE CAN BE BROUGHT UP TO THE 21ST CENTURY AND DEVELOP PROPERLY, BE IN THE MAINSTREAM OF THE OTHER COUNTIES AND CITIES NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED. AND WE HAVE NOT DONE THAT. OUR AREA, WHERE OUR PROJECT IS, WE BASICALLY CALL IT THE WILD, WILD WEST. WE ARE PROOF IN THE PUDDING WITH THIS.

OUR AREA THAT MASTER PD WILL HELP, OUR AREA, WE HAVE MISMATCHED ZONING THAT DOESN'T MAKE ANY SENSE. INDIAN RIVER DRIVE RUNS THROUGH OUR PROPERTY. WE'VE GOT THE BUILDINGS THAT WERE BUILT IN THE 1900S, WHERE IT IS BUTTING UP RIGHT AGAINST THE STREET. SO WE ARE THE ONES THAT THE PD WILL EXACTLY FIX OUR SITUATION AND GIVE US FLEXIBILITY FOR US ALL TOGETHER TO FIGURE OUT THE BEST USE OF THE PROPERTY AND

THE CHALLENGES. >> THANK YOU, MA'AM. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. WE APPRECIATE IT. APPRECIATE IT. ANYONE ELSE? ANYONE ELSE WISHING TO ADDRESS THIS ISSUE, PLEASE COME FORWARD. SEEING NO MOVEMENT, I WILL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AND BRING IT BACK TO THE COMMISSION. I WOULD JUST LIKE TO ADD THAT I WATCHED THE PLANNING BOARD DISCUSSED THIS AND THERE WERE QUITE A FEW QUESTIONS OF MR. FREEMAN. AND HE ANSWERED THEIR QUESTIONS AND TALKED ABOUT WHAT THE PLANNING STAFF WAS -- I HAVE A FEELING THEY WILL BE WORKING WITH THIS AND THINKING ABOUT THIS. IN TERMS OF WATCHING IT AS IT PROCEEDS IN MAKING SURE THAT IF ANYTHING NEEDS TO BE CHANGED, THAT IT WILL BE CHANGED. SO IS THERE A MOTION OR DISCUSSION?

>> I MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE.

>> SECOND. >> EMOTION IN A SECOND. CALL

THE ROLL, PLEASE. >>

[c. Quasi-Judicial Hearing - Ordinance No. 24-018 an ordinance by the City Commission of the City of Fort Pierce, Florida; amending the City's zoning atlas and rezoning one(1) parcel generally located at or near 301 Florida Ave, containing approximately 0.38 Acres of land, more or less, from General Commercial (C-3) to Planned Development (PD); Parcel ID: 2410-711-0041-000-7. FIRST READING]

OUR NEXT ITEM IS A QUASIJUDICIAL HEARING FOR ORDINANCE 24-018. AN ORDINANCE FOR THE CITY COMMISSION BY THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE, FLORIDA, AMENDING THE CITY'S ZONING ATLAS AND REZONING ONE PARCEL GENERALLY LOCATED AT OR NEAR 301 FORD AVENUE, CONTAINING APPROXIMATELY 0.38 ACRES OF LAND, MORE OR LESS, FROM C-32 PLAN TO DEVELOPMENT. IN PROVIDING FOR AN EFFECTIVE DATE. THIS IS THE FIRST

READING. >> THIS IS A QUASIJUDICIAL HEARING. WE HAVE AT LEAST ONE OTHER AND AN APPEAL. SO, FOR THESE TWO, MADAM ATTORNEY, WILL YOU READ THE GUIDELINES,

PLEASE? >> THE CITY COMMISSION SERVICES A LEGISLATIVE AND QUASIJUDICIAL ROLE CONNECTING AS A LEGISLATIVE BODY, THE BODY ENGAGES IN LAWMAKING ACTIVITIES MIGHT A PASSING LAWS AND ESTABLISHING ACTIVITIES. WHEN ACTING AS A QUASIJUDICIAL BODY, THE COMMISSION APPLIES THOSE LAWS AND POLICIES AND IS HELD TO STRICTER PROCEDURAL REQUIREMENTS. QUASIJUDICIAL PROCEEDINGS ARE LESS FORMAL THAN PROCEEDINGS BEFORE A CIRCUIT COURT BUT ARE MORE FORMAL THAN A NORMAL COMMISSION MEETING. QUASIJUDICIAL PROCEEDINGS MUST FOLLOW BASIC STANDARDS OF NOTICE AND PROCESS AND MUST MAKE DECISIONS BASED ON EVIDENCE. THAT IS WHY THE COMMISSION HAS ESTABLISHED THE UNIFORM PROCEDURES FOR QUASIJUDICIAL HEARINGS THAT WILL BE FOLLOWED THIS EVENING.

FINALLY, NO ONE SHOULD APPROACH ANY MEMBER OF THE CITY COMMISSION ON THE DAIS, THE CITY ATTORNEY, OR THE CITY CLERK DURING THE MEETING. DR. DESSERT TO BE GIVEN TO THE CITY CLERK, PLEASE GIVE THEM TO THE SERGEANT AT ARMS, WHICH IS ANY OF THE POLICE OFFICERS IN THE CHAMBER.

[00:55:02]

>> MADAM CLERK, WILL YOU CONFIRM COMPLIANCE WITH THE ADVERTISING AND NOTICE REQUIREMENTS?

>> YES, MA'AM. THE NOTICE HAS BEEN MET. AT THIS TIME, WOULD YOU ASK COMMISSIONERS ABOUT EX PARTE COMMUNICATIONS?

>> WOULD YOU LIKE TO SWEAR IN THE WITNESSES?

>> ANYONE WISHING TO SPEAK ON THIS ITEM, PLEASE STAND AND RAISE YOUR RIGHT HAND. DO YOU SWEAR TO TELL THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH? THANK YOU.

>> PLEASE PROCEED. >> MAYOR, CITY COMMISSION, THIS IS AN APPLICATION FOR A AMENDMENT TO THE CITY ZONING ATLAS FROM C 3. THE APPLICANT IS MARCELLA AND ASSOCIATE, THE PARCEL I.D. IS 2403-705-0119-00 0-4. SO THIS IS A REQUEST TO ACCOMMODATE A SMALL 7000 SQUARE-FOOT BUILDING ON A COMMERCIAL SITE. IT IS IN THE FORT PIERCE READABILITY AREA AROUND FLORIDA AVENUE. SO THE APPLICANT AND THE APPLICATION WE RECEIVED, AND THE DISCUSSIONS THAT WE HAD WITH THEM, THAT THEY ARE SEEKING TO DEVELOP, IN A MANNER WHICH IS CONDUCIVE WITH A PEDESTRIAN FRIENDLY URBAN COMMERCIAL AND INDUSTRIAL DISTRICT. YOU WILL SEE IN A MOMENT THE LOCATION OF THE SITE AND HOW IT LOOKS AT THE PRESENT. ON STREET PARKING IS INCORPORATED. FOR CUSTOMERS AS WELL AS TO IMPROVE THE PUBLIC REALM. THAT IS HOW THE THING LOOKS ON THE STREET. SO THERE IS A SITE, A SMALL AREA, FLORIDA AVENUE, U.S. HIGHWAY 1, BEFORE FLORIDA AND GEORGIA. IT IS ON THE SOUTHERN EDGE OF THE FORT PIERCE ELEMENT AREA. THAT IS THE STREET AS IT STANDS AT THE MOMENT. YOU CAN SEE THAT IT HAS BEEN DEVELOPED IN AD HOC MEANS. IT HAS INDUSTRIAL UNIT. THERE ARE RETAIL UNITS ON U.S.

1, A VACANT PROPERTY, THE STREET ITSELF IS REALLY NOT DEFINED AS SOMETHING THAT YOU MIGHT WANT TO SEE IN A REDEVELOPMENT AREA. WE ARE NOT CHANGING OR PROPOSING TO CHANGE, THE APPLICANT IS NOT PROPOSING TO CHANGE FUTURE LAND USE, WHICH REMAINS GENERAL COMMERCIAL. YOU CAN SEE IT IT'S AN INDUSTRIAL DESIGNATION. IN A MAJORITY, IF NOT ALL OF THE PROPERTY AROUND THAT ARE ALSO FUTURE LAND USE AND GENERAL COMMERCIAL. SO THE CURRENT ZONING IS C 3. ONE OF THE ISSUES THAT WE FOUND WITH THE C 3 ZONING IS THAT IT REQUIRES A 25 FOOT FRONT AND BACK SETBACK. MOVING THE SITE 25 FEET BACK FROM FLORIDA REALLY DICTATES THAT IS WHERE YOUR PARKING HAS TO GO. THAT IS THE RESPONSE TO THIS TYPE OF ZONING IN TERMS OF GENERAL DEVELOPMENT DEVOTEE. AND THIS IS WHY WE SUGGESTED TO THE APPLICANT, PLEASE CONSIDER A PLANNED DEVELOPMENT FOR THIS LOCATION. THE CODE AT THE MOMENT MEANS YOU HAVE TO DO A FULL SUBMITTAL. WE HAVE TO SEE EVERYTHING YOU DO. SO THAT WAS A DECISION FROM THE APPLICANT THAT WE HAD MANAGED TO CONVINCE THEM TO TAKE THE RISK, TO TRUST US, AND TO SAY THIS IS WHAT WE ARE LOOKING FOR, FOR THE CITY.

WHAT WE ARE ASKING FROM THE APPLICANT IS A BETTER DESIGN, LET'S GET SOMETHING THAT STARTS TO SET OUT THE STREET SCAPE HERE. LET'S DEFINE HOW THE STREET WILL LOOK WHEN ALL THESE OTHER PROPERTIES HOPEFULLY COME IN AND REDEVELOP. NOW THE NEIGHBORS SEE THE VALUE OF COMING IN.

HOPEFULLY THIS IS A SUCCESSFUL DEVELOPMENT AND IT REALLY INITIATES THAT REDEVELOPMENT SPARK. SO THERE IS A PROPOSED SITE PLAN. AS YOU CAN SEE, THE BUILDING FRONT, BOTH SOUTH THIRD STREET IN FLORIDA AVENUE RIGHT OF REALLY UP TO THE BOUNDARY. THEY DO INCORPORATE ADDITIONAL SIDEWALK AREA AND LANDSCAPING DOWN THE SIDES. SOME ON STREET PARKING. A MAJORITY OF THE ACTIVITY OF THIS BUILDING WILL BE UNDERTAKEN FROM THE REAR WITH THE LOADING BAYS AND THE PARKING. THE LANDSCAPING PLAN, WE'VE GOT THEM AS FAR AS WE COULD TO GET AS MUCH LANDSCAPING IN THERE AS

[01:00:02]

POSSIBLE. AND THOSE ARE THE TREES AND SHRUBS THAT WE GOT IN THERE, A SUBSTANTIAL AMOUNT FOR THAT SMALL SITE. THERE ARE PROPOSED ELEVATIONS OF THE BUILDING. IT REALLY LOOKS STANDARD ONCE YOU SEE THEM IN THAT WAY. BUT ONCE YOU SEE A RENDERING OF THOSE ELEVATIONS , THIS IS A BUILDING THAT WE HOPE WILL START TO SET THE STANDARD OF THIS TYPE OF USE. THIS IS A FLEX SPACE. A COMBINATION OF OFFICE AND SMALL BUSINESS USE.

SOME ACTIVITIES IN THE REAR, SMALL BUSINESSES COMING IN THERE, HOPEFULLY, AND UTILIZING THESE AS SHOWROOMS OR WHATEVER THEY NEED TO DO IN THERE. SO WE ARE QUITE SUPPORTIVE, VERY SUPPORTIVE OF THIS KIND OF DEVELOPMENT. IT SETS UP THE STREET OUT AND ENCOURAGES PEDESTRIAN ACTIVITY. AND PARKING ASIDE FROM STREET PARKING IS LOCATED AROUND THE REAR OF THE BUILDING. IT DOES NOT AFFECT THE VISUAL ASPECT OF THE ARCHITECTURE THAT HAS BEEN INTRODUCED HERE. SOME OF THE THINGS THAT WERE ASKED FOR WITH THE PD WAS TO REDUCE THE FRONT YARD SETBACK, THE SIDE YARD SET BACK, FOR THAT TO BE REDUCED.

IN RETURN, THE LOT COVERAGE WAS REDUCED AS FAR AS WE COULD WITH IMPERVIOUS AND OTHER TREATMENTS. AND THEN WE ASKED, LET'S LOOK AT THE ARCHITECTURE OF THIS. LET'S REALLY SET A STANDARD FOR THIS INDUSTRIAL, COMMERCIAL AREA, CLOSE TO DOWNTOWN FORT PIERCE THAT CAN BE SEEN FROM U.S. 1. AND WE WANT TO INFLUENCE THAT ON U.S. 1 IS THAT WHEN PEOPLE DRIVE IN, THEY ARE GETTING AN INDICATION OF SOME SORT OF REDEVELOPMENT ACTIVITY GOING ON IN A POSITIVE WAY. AND HOPEFULLY THIS IS A SUCCESSFUL DEVELOPMENT SHOULD GET APPROVED. SO STAFF IS VERY SUPPORTIVE OF THIS. WE HAVE HAD GOOD NEGOTIATIONS WITH THE APPLICANT. IT HAS TAKEN LONGER THAN JUST A STRAIGHT ZONING APPLICATION WOULD. BUT AS A RESULT, WE WOULD THINK IT IS A DEMONSTRATION OF WHAT YOU WOULD GET COMING FORWARD WITH A PLAN DEVELOPMENT IN AN AREA THAT REALLY NEEDS SOME ACTIVITY. SO WE APPRECIATE WHAT THE APPLICANT PUT UP WITH IN GOING THROUGH THIS. BUT AS FAR AS WE COME TO YOU TODAY, IT IS A RECOMMENDATION TO APPROVE. THANK YOU.

>> QUESTIONS OF STAFF? QUESTIONS OF STAFF? NO QUESTIONS? OKAY. I WOULD LIKE FOR THE APPLICANT TO COME FORWARD, PLEASE. DO YOU HAVE QUESTIONS OF STAFF?

>> I DO NOT HAVE ANY QUESTIONS OF STAFF.

>> COULD YOU STATE YOUR NAME FOR THE RECORD?

>> JASON GUENTHER, THOMAS ENGINEERING, SOUTHEAST OSCEOLA STREET APPEARS TO FOR THE IS OUR OFFICE. MARCELLA CANDLER WAS ON VACATION THIS WEEK SO I AM FILLING IN ON THE CIVIL ENGINEER. WITH ME IS ANTHONY GURSKY, THE OWNER / DEVELOPER.

IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS. MR. FREEMAN DID A GOOD JOB OF OUTLINING OUR PROJECT. WE DO NOT HAVE ANYTHING MORE TO ADD.

WE WILL JUST ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MAY HAVE.

>> YOU ARE SOREN -- SWORN IN, CORRECT?

>> YES. >> ANY QUESTIONS OF THE APPLICANT? ANYONE ELSE IN THE AUDIENCE LIKING TO ADDRESS THIS ISSUE, PLEASE COME FORWARD. ANYONE ELSE? SEEING NO ONE, I WILL CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AND BRING IT BACK TO THE COMMISSION. ANY QUESTIONS OR DISCUSSION? OR IS THERE A

MOTION? >> META-MAYOR, GOING BACK TO DEPRIVE HER DISCUSSION, THIS IS THE PERFECT EXAMPLE OF THE APPLICATION OF THE SOON TO BE ADOPTED PLAN. THAT YOU PRESENTED. THIS IS WHAT WE ARE DISCUSSING HERE, EXACTLY. AND IF THIS IS THE NATURE OF DEVELOPMENT MOVING FORWARD, WE CAN SEE HOW WELL THIS CAN BE EXECUTED UPON. I THINK, WAS IT

SET UP THAT WAY? >> THE PD WAS CONTINUED --

>> WE WERE IN CAHOOTS TOGETHER ON THAT.

>> THE PLANNING BOARD CONSIDERED THIS AND THEY SAID

IT IS THE PERFECT EXAMPLE. >> THIS GIVES YOU THE AMMUNITION THAT YOU NEED TO ACCOMPLISH THIS. ON THAT NOTE, I WOULD MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE.

>> SECOND. >> CALL THE ROLL, PLEASE.

[d. Quasi-Judicial Hearing and Resolution 24-R29 on notice of appeal filed by the City of Fort Pierce to appeal a decision made by the Historic Preservation Board on March 25, 2024, pursuant to Fort Pierce Code of Ordinance, Sec. 111-53, approving an application for conditional use for an expansion of outdoor entertainment area at 411 N 2nd Street..]

[01:05:12]

QUASIJUDICIAL APPEAL ON 24 -29, RESOLUTION OF THE CITY COMMISSION OF FORT PIERCE, FLORIDA, ISSUING AN ORDER OF FINDINGS, BASED UPON COVETED FINDINGS BASED ON AN APPEAL HEARING UNDER THE -- HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD DECISION ENTERED ON MARCH 25TH, 2024 FOR A PROPERTY LOCATED AT 411 NORTH SECOND STREET, FORT PIERCE, FLORIDA PEER PROVIDING A NOTICE TO ALL PARTIES FOR A SEVERABILITY CLAUSE, REPEALING ALL RESOLUTIONS IN CONFLICT HEREWITH, AND PROVIDING FOR AN

EFFECTIVE DATE. >> MADAME MAYOR, CAN I REQUEST A TWO MINUTE RECESS? LAST TIME I WENT TO THE RESTROOM. IN A QUASIJUDICIAL, YOU HAD TO STOP BECAUSE THE SPEAKERS WERE NOT WORKING OR SOMETHING. SORRY, FOLKS.

>> WE ARE IN RECESS FOR 2 MINUTE'S.

RECESS. THE SESSION WILL RECONVENE IN TWO MINUTES.

CAPTIONER ON STANDBY. ]

[01:10:08]

>> ALL RIGHT. THIS IS AN UNUSUAL SITUATION CLOSE TO QUASIJUDICIAL. MADAME ATTORNEY, WOULD YOU READ US THE

GUIDELINES, PLEASE? >> YES, MA'AM. THIS ONE IS LONGER THAN USUAL. PLEASE BEAR WITH ME. THE MAYOR SHALL CONDUCT THE PROCEEDINGS AND MAINTAINED ORDER. THE CITY ATTORNEY SHALL RULE IN ALL EVIDENTIARY AND PROCEDURAL ISSUES AND OBJECTIONS. A PROCEDURE SHALL NOT APPLY EXCEPT AS SET FORTH WITH A PROCEDURE. HOWEVER, FUNDAMENTAL DUE PROCESS SHALL BE RECORDED. THE APPELLATE AND APPLICANT WILL MAKE THEIR OPINIONS BASED ONLY ON MATERIALS SUBMITTED TO THE CITY CLERK, WHICH HAS BEEN ATTACHED TO THE AGENDA. WE WILL MAKE AN ORAL PRESENTATION AS TO WHY IT SHOULD WIN THE APPEAL.

THE ORAL PRESENTATION IS LIMITED TO 20 MINUTES. THERE ARE NO ADDITIONAL WITNESSES, EXHIBITS, OR EVIDENCE THAT MAY BE INTRODUCED. THERE IS RESERVED TIME FOR IN A BOTTLE AFTER THE APPLICATION. AFTER THE APPELLANT HAS COMPLETED ITS ARGUMENT, COMMISSIONERS MAY ASK AS MANY QUESTIONS AS HE APPELLANT AS DESIRED. QUESTIONS MUST BE ADDRESSED TO THE REPRESENTATIVE ONLY. NO ADDITIONAL INFORMATION CAN BE SUBMITTED. QUESTIONS ARE LIMITED TO THE MATERIALS AND RECORD PROVIDED AND STATEMENTS MADE BY THE PRESENTER. AFTER ALL OF THE QUESTIONS HAVE BEEN ADDRESSED, THE APPLICANT WILL HAVE 20 MINUTES TO MAKE AN ORAL PRESENTATION. THERE WERE NO ADDITIONAL WITNESSES, EXHIBITS, OR EVIDENCE INTRODUCED. AFTER THE APPLICANT HAS COMPLETED SEGMENT, MISSIONERS MAY ASK AS MANY QUESTIONS OF THE INDIVIDUAL AS DESIRED, NO ADDITIONAL INFORMATION CAN BE SUBMITTED. QUESTIONS ARE LIMITED TO THE MATERIAL AND RECORD PROVIDED AND STATEMENTS MADE BY THE PRESENTER. AT THE CONCLUSION OF ALL ARGUMENTS AND QUESTIONS, THE CITY COMMISSION WILL CONDUCT OPEN DELIBERATIONS ON THE APPEAL. AFTER DELIBERATIONS, A VOTE SHALL BE TAKEN TO AFFIRM, MODIFY , OR REVERSE THE DECISION OF THE LOWER BOARD, WHICH IS THE SUBJECT OF THE APPEAL. THE STANDARD OF PROOF FOR TONIGHT'S HEARING IS COMPETENT SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE CONTAINED IN THE RECORD OF THE ORAL ARGUMENTS OF THE APPELLANT AND THE APPLICANT. CIRCUMSTANTIAL EVIDENCE IS EVIDENCE THAT IS ESTABLISHED, SORRY. COMPETENT SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE IS EVIDENCE THAT WILL ESTABLISH A SUBSTANTIAL BASIS FOR WHICH THE EFFECT OF THE ISSUE CAN BE REASONABLY INFERRED. INCLUDES FACT OR OPINION EVIDENCE OFFERED BY AN EXPERT ON A MATTER THAT REQUIRES SPECIALIZED KNOWLEDGE. THAT IS RELEVANT TO THE ISSUES TO BE DECIDED. IT IS EVIDENCE THAT A REASONABLE MIND COULD ACCEPT AS HAVING WEIGHT AND ADEQUATE TO SUPPORT A LEGAL CONCLUSION.

HYPOTHETICAL, SPECULATIVE, FEAR, OR EMOTION BASED STATEMENTS THAT DO NOT ADDRESS RELEVANT ISSUES AND THAT CANNOT BE REASONABLY SAID TO SUPPORT THE ACTION ADVOCATED ARE NOT COMPETENT SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE.

>> THANK YOU, MA'AM. AT THIS TIME, EXPERT TAKEN MEDICATIONS SHOULD BE DISCLOSED BY EACH MEMBER OF THE CITY COMMISSION.

CLERK, PLEASE CALL THE ROLL. >> QUESTION ON THE EXPERT TAKEN MEDICATIONS, WHO WOULD WE HAVE BEEN COMMUNICATE WITH?

>> I GUESS IN THE REALM OF THE APPEAL.

>> OKAY. CITY STAFF? >> CITY STAFF OR THE APPLICANT.

>> YES, META-MAYOR AND COMMISSIONERS. ANY COMMUNICATIONS, AS WELL AS ANY SITE VISITS OR EXPERT OPINIONS THAT HAVE BEEN OBTAINED SHOULD BE DISCLOSED AT THIS TIME.

>> THE APPLICANT IS THE CITY. CORRECT?

>> THE APPELLANT IS THE CITY. THE APPLICANT IS PIERCE SITE WORKS PIERCE MAY HAVE HAD NO DISCUSSIONS WITH THE APPLICANT.

I'VE HAD DISCUSSIONS WITH THE APPELLANT, THE CITY STAFF, AND I'M VERY FAMILIAR WITH THE SITE.

>> COMMISSIONER GAINES? >> LET ME THINK ABOUT THAT. I HAVE NOT HAD ANY DISCUSSIONS , EXCEPT THE LAST TIME THIS ISSUE WAS IN FRONT OF THE BOARD. I DID RECEIVE AN EMAIL, I THINK EVERYBODY DID, REGARDING THE HISTORIC BOARD'S MEETING ABOUT THIS SUBJECT. SO I READ THAT EMAIL BUT I HAVE NOT TALKED TO

ANYBODY. >> COMMISSIONER JOHNSON?

>> SAME, I RECEIVED THE EMAIL.

>> COMMISSIONER J JOHNSON? >> I HAVE HAD NOT HAD ANY CONVERSATION WITH THE APPLICANT. I HAVE HAD MINOR COMMUNITY WITH THE CITY MANAGER'S. AND I HAVE VISITED THE SITE. AND I HAVE RECEIVED ONE EMAIL FROM CHARLIE HIATT,

THAT IS ON PUBLIC RECORD. >> I NEED TO ADD TO MINE THAT I RECEIVED THE SAME EMAIL. THANK YOU.

>> MAYOR HUDSON? >> I RECEIVED THE EMAIL, BUT I

[01:15:01]

DO NOT THINK IT WAS VIDEOTAPED, BUT I LISTENED TO THE AUDIO TAPE OF THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD. THAT IS IT.

>> THANK YOU. >> SO WE WILL NOW OPEN THE HEARING ON THIS MATTER. SO WE ARE NOT SWEARING IN WITNESSES.

IS THAT CORRECT? >> I DID NOT IN THIS ONE. WE

CAN IF WE THINK WE SHOULD. >> I WOULD SUGGEST THAT WE DO.

ANYONE THAT PLANS TO SPEAK ON THIS, PLEASE STAND AND THE

CLERK WILL SWEAR YOU IN. >> ANYBODY? DO YOU SWEAR OR AFFIRM TO TELL THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, NOTHING BUT THE

TRUTH? THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU. SO THE APPELLANT WILL GO FIRST AND MAKE AN ORAL PRESENTATION AS TO WHY IT SHOULD WIN THE APPEAL. IN THIS CASE, THE APPELLANT IS THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE. THAT IS YOU, MR. FREEMAN, I THINK.

>> MADAME MAYOR, I WILL LEAD THIS OFF.

>> THAT IS MR. MIMS. >> MEMBERS OF THE CITY COMMISSION, THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE IS APPEALING A DECISION MADE BY THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD ON MARCH 25TH, 2024, WITH REGARD TO THE CONDITIONAL USE FOR AN EXPANSION OF OUTDOOR ENTERTAINMENT AREA FOR NORTH SECOND STREET. THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE REQUESTS THAT THE CITY COMMISSION REVIEW THE DECISION TO ALLOW THE INCREASE IN AREA, UTILIZED AS OUTDOOR ENTERTAINMENT SPACE BASED ON OF THE IMPACT GENERATED BY THE EXPANSION OF THE OUTDOOR ENTERTAINMENT SPACE ON THE HEALTH AND WELFARE OF IMMEDIATE NEIGHBORS OF THE SUBJECT PROPERTY. WE DO HAVE WITH US OUR DIRECTOR OF PLANNING WHO CAN PROVIDE AN OVERVIEW OF THE ACTUAL EXPANSION AND WHAT THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE IS CURRENTLY APPEALING. SO I WILL TURN IT OVER TO OUR DIRECT.

>> MR. FREEMAN, YOU MAY PROCEED BUT BEFORE YOU DO, I WANT TO REMIND CITY COMMISSIONERS THAT THIS IS THE ONLY TIME THAT YOU HAVE QUESTIONS OF THE APPELLANT, WHICH IS EITHER MR. FREEMAN OR MR. MIMS. I WANT TO REMIND YOU OF THAT. OKAY,

PLEASE PROCEED. >> THANK YOU. AS THE CITY MANAGER HAS JUST VERBALIZED AND THE CITY APPEALING THE DECISION OF THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD AND ITS MEETING ON MARCH 25TH, 2024, IN RESPECT OF THIS APPLICATION FOR ADDITIONAL OUTDOOR SPACE FOR OUTDOOR ENTERTAINMENT ABOVE THE 800 SQUARE FEET THAT IS ALLOWED BY CODE. THE PROPERTY IS LOCATED AT 411 NORTH SECOND STREET, FORT PIERCE. IT IS KNOWN AS PIERCE SITE WORKS. IT IS A BAR WITH OUTDOOR ENTERTAINMENT WHERE PEOPLE GATHER. THOSE ARE PHOTOGRAPHS THAT WERE SUBMITTED WITH THE APPLICAION. THAT IS THE STAGE THAT HAS BEEN PREVIOUSLY APPROVED. THESE ARE THE AREAS THAT ARE UTILIZED FOR OUTDOOR ENTERTAINMENT. THAT IS A SITE PLAN SUBMITTED BY THE APPLICANT IN RELATION TO THE REQUEST, WHICH OUTLINED THE WHOLE SITE, AND, WHICH, WHEN CITY STAFF TRIED TO MEASURE AND WE GOT TO A SORT OF PROVISIONAL NUMBER OF 5000 SQUARE FEET OF OUTDOOR SPACE. SO THE CITY, THE APPELLANT, REQUESTED THAT THE CITY COMMISSION REVIEW THE DECISION TO ALLOW THE INCREASE IN AREA UTILIZED AS OUTDOOR ENTERTAINMENT SPACE BASED ON THE IMPACT GENERATED BY THE EXPANSION OF THE OUTDOOR ENTERTAINMENT SPACE ON THE HEALTH AND WELFARE OF IMMEDIATE NEIGHBORS OF THE SUBJECT PROPERTY. THE APPELLANT SEEKS RELIEF FROM THE ANTICIPATED ADDITIONAL NOISE AT AMITY AND A DISTURBANCE RESULTING FROM THE EXPANSION OF THE AREA AVAILABLE FOR OUTDOOR ENTERTAINMENT. AS A BACKGROUND, THE PROPERTY, WHICH IS THREE CONTRIBUTING HISTORIC STRUCTURES ARE LOCATED IN THE EDGARTOWN ZONING DISTRICT AND SUBJECT TO A SPECIAL ZONING REGULATION, WHICH RESTRICTS THE OUTDOOR ENTERTAINMENT AREA TO A MAXIMUM OF 800 SQUARE FEET. THE EXISTING STAGE ON-SITE, WHICH YOU HAVE SEEN IN THE PHOTOGRAPH, WAS APPROVED IN SEPTEMBER OF 28 OF 2021. THIS CASE GOES BACK TO NOVEMBER 15TH, 2023, WHERE THE SPECIAL MAGISTRATE FOUND THAT THIS BUSINESS WAS IN VIOLATION OF THE CODE IN THE FOLLOWING CORRECTIVE ACTIONS WERE SET TO BE TAKEN, TO REDUCE THE AREA UTILIZED FOR EXTERNAL RESTAURANT PUB USE TO 800

[01:20:04]

SQUARE FEET, OR OBTAIN A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT THROUGH PLANNING AND ZONING TO EXTEND THE AREA ALLOWED TO BE UTILIZED FOR EXTERIOR RESTAURANT USE. SUBSEQUENTLY, THE APPLICANT SUBMITTED AN ADDITIONAL USE TO EXPAND THE OUTDOOR USES OF THE PIERCE SITE OR WORK , WHICH WAS PRESENTED TO THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD ON FEBRUARY 26, 2024. BUT THEN GOT CONTINUED AT THE MEETING TO MARCH 25TH, 2024. AT THE MARCH 25TH, 2024 HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD MEETING, STEPH ADVISED THAT THE PRESERVATION BOARD MAY APPROVE THE REQUEST FOR THE APPROPRIATE PROPOSED CONDITIONAL USE NOTING CITY NOISE LIMIT OF 55 DECIBELS AND ADDING ADDITIONAL LANDSCAPING, OR APPROVE THE REQUEST WITH ADDITIONAL CONDITIONS AS MAY BE REQUESTED BY THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD, OR DENY THE REQUEST FOR THE CONTENT PROPOSED CONDITIONAL USE. AT ITS MEETING, THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD DETERMINED TO APPROVE THE CONDITIONAL USE APPLICATION TO ALLOW FOR 5000 SQUARE FEET OF EXTERIOR SPACE TO BE USED FOR OUTDOOR ENTERTAINMENT SUBJECT TO THE CITY'S NOISE REGULATIONS. SO, AS WE MOVE FORWARD TO COMMISSION OPTIONS WITH THIS, THE COMMISSION OPTION NUMBER ONE IS THAT THE MARCH 25TH, 2024 DECISION OF THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD IS HEREBY AFFIRMED, OR THE MARCH 25TH, 2024 DECISION OF THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD IS HEREBY MODIFIED AS FOLLOWS. AND THAT WOULD BE SUBJECT TO ANY COMMENTS MADE BY THE CITY COMMISSION. THE MARCH 25TH, 2024 DECISION OF THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD IS HEREBY REVERSED. IN THE APPLICATION FOR CONDITIONAL USE IS DENIED, BASED UPON EVIDENCE PRESENTED THAT ITS APPROVAL WILL HARM THE -- YEAH. THAT WOULD BE A DECISION, AGAIN. DETERMINATION BY THE CITY COMMISSION. AS WE HAVE HEARD FROM THE CITY ATTORNEY, THERE IS A STANDARD OF PROOF THAT NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED HERE. AND SO THEN I WILL AND THAT AND HAND OVER TO THE CITY COMMISSION OR THE APPELLANT, TO CONTINUE THE

HEARING. >> ALL RIGHT. QUESTIONS OF STAFF, THIS IS YOUR CHANCE. COMMISSIONER GAINES?

>> THANK YOU, DIRECT OR FREEMAN. CAN YOU GO BACK TO THE TIMELINE OF THE HEARING? THE QUESTION IS SIMPLE AS THIS. WAS THE CITY PRESENT, OR ANYBODY, STEPH OR SOMEBODY PRESENT AT THIS HEARING? DID WE GIVE ANY TYPE OF TESTIMONY , ANY TYPE OF, OTHER THAN WHAT I READ HERE, IT WOULD DO ANYTHING AT THE HEARING TO SAY THIS IS WHAT WE WANTED, THIS IS NOT WHAT WE WANTED, OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.

>> THE MEETING OF THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD, I THINK STAFF WERE IN ATTENDANCE, THEY PRESENTED THE APPLICATION, AND THEY MADE THOSE THREE RECOMMENDATIONS AND LEFT THE DECISION-MAKING TO THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD.

>> I JUST WANT TO BE CLEAR. THE THREE RECOMMENDATIONS THAT THE CITY MADE ARE THE ONES THAT WERE HERE? AND THEN THE BOARD DETERMINED TO APPROVE IT TO ALLOW, BASED ON WHAT WE SAID, THE BOARD DETERMINED THAT TWO APPROVAL FOR THE 5000 SQUARE FEET, BUT SUBJECT TO THE CITY'S NOISE REGULATIONS.

>> THAT IS CORRECT. >> THANK YOU.

>> MR. FREEMAN, I WOULD LIKE TO DIAL IN SPECIFICALLY TO THE EDGARTOWN DISTRICT, IF WE COULD. SPECIFICALLY ABOUT THE EDGARTOWN DISTRICT. IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY, AND I HAVE READ CORRECTLY AND WHAT OUR CODE STATES, THERE ARE OPTIONS FOR ALL THE PARCEL OWNERS WITHIN EDGARTOWN TO APPLY FOR CONDITIONAL USES WITHIN THE DISTRICT ?

>> THAT IS CORRECT, YES. >> HAS APPLICANT ON THAT?

>> YES. >> OKAY. IN ADDITION TO THAT, DURING THE CONDITIONAL USE PROCESS, DO THEY GET TO A POINT OF APPLICATION SPECIFIC TO NOT ONLY SPACE OR USE OF SPACE, DID THEY ALSO TALK ABOUT NOISE AN APPLICATION? EY DID REFER TO EI STAFF, OR THE APPLICANT DID REFER TO THE OVERRIDING 55

[01:25:01]

DECIBEL LIMIT THAT HAS BEEN APPLIED SPECIFICALLY TO THE

EDGARTOWN ZONING DISTRICT. >> ARE THERE ANY ADDITIONAL REQUESTS BASED ON OPERATION OF THE PARCEL OR JUST OUTDOOR

SPACE? >> THERE WERE NO SPECIFIC REQUESTS MADE ON THE TYPE OF BUSINESS OR THE OPERATION OF THE BUSINESS. IT WAS ENTIRELY ON THE AMOUNT OF SPACE USED.

>> THE BUSINESS HAS BEEN ESTABLISHED, BEEN OPERATING, AND MEETS ALL CONDITIONS OF CITY CODE TO YOUR KNOWLEDGE. IS

THAT ACCURATE? >> TO MY KNOWLEDGE, YES. WITH THE EXCEPTION OF THE USE OF THE OUTDOOR SPACE, WHETHER THAT IS

APPROVED HERE WITH OR NOT. >> COULD YOU HELP ME UNDERSTAND OR DEFINE, IN YOUR PROFESSIONAL EXPERIENCE , THIS SPACE SPECIFICALLY TO THE EXISTING CODE? I KNOW THERE ARE DEMONSTRATIONS HERE, WHICH I WILL HEAR ABOUT FROM THE APPLICANT. AND YOUR INTERPRETATION OF THE CODE, DIGGING FOR ME TO THE 800 SQUARE FEET. IS IT SOMETHING THAT IS SUPPOSED TO BE ANCILLARY TO THE BUSINESS OPERATION? IS IT SOMETHING THAT IS SUPPOSED TO BE ADJOINING THE BUILDING? OR WHAT COMPONENTS OF THE PLANNING SPECIFICALLY DO

YOU SEE? >> IN MY OPINION, THE 800 SQUARE FEET THAT IS LIMITED UNDER THE CODE IS A FOR USES THAT ARE ANCILLARY TO THE BUSINESS ONGOING AT THAT LOCATION. HOW THEY ARE CONNECTED TO THAT BUILDING COULD BE BY A SINGLE PATHWAY OR AN OPEN AREA. ANY SPACE THAT IS UTILIZED FOR OUTDOOR ENTERTAINMENT SHOULD BE COUNTED IN THAT SQUARE FOOTAGE. YEAH. I THINK THAT IS IT.

>> OKAY. SPECIFIC TO THE, DO YOU HAVE IN YOUR PRESENTATION HOW THE CODE READS AT THE 800 SQUARE FEET?

>> I DO NOT HAVE THAT EXTRACT. BUT THE MAXIMUM AMOUNT OF THE ALLOWED OUTDOOR USE SPACE IS 800 SQUARE FEET. THE CODE ALSO ALLOWS THAT TO BE APPLIED THROUGH A CONDITIONAL USE TO BE

EXTENDED. >> THANK YOU FOR THAT. DO YOU HAVE KNOWLEDGE OF THE EXISTING BUSINESSES? BTR, THE APPLICATIONS, AND WHAT CLASSIFICATIONS THEY ARE UNDER?

>> I DON'T KNOW THAT. ALTHOUGH THEY ARE OPERATING AS AN ACCEPTED USE WITHIN THAT ZONING DISTRICT.

>> YES. OKAY. SO WE PROBABLY NEED TO GET THAT INFORMATION SOMEHOW AT SOME POINT. BECAUSE I THINK THAT INFORMATION IS IMPORTANT TO DISCUSSING HOW THE CODE WAS ORIGINALLY APPLIED, HOW IT WAS DEVELOPED. IN YOUR TESTIMONY, I JUST HEARD DOUCET ABOUT THE ANCILLARY USES OF THE OUTDOOR SPACE RELATED TO THE VISITS ENTITY. THE WAY I SEE THIS SECTION OF THE EDGARTOWN

DISTRICT -- >> YES. IT IS ALL IN ONE TABLE THAT OUTLINES THE SPACE AND TYPE OF USE.

>> OKAY. HOLD FOR NOW. THANK YOU.

>> MR. FREEMAN, THE OFFICES OF MAINSTREET ARE ACROSS THE STREET FROM THIS AND LOCATED IN EDGARTOWN, IS THAT CORRECT?

>> I BELIEVE SO, YES. >> DOES THIS AFFECT THE OPERATION OF THE MAIN STREET AND ITS OPERATIONS?

>> NOT THAT I WOULD BE MADE AWARE. I DO NOT HAVE EVIDENCE TO SAY THAT IT AFFECTS OR DOES NOT AFFECT THE OPERATION.

>> THAT WAS IN THE EMAIL THAT WE RECEIVED. AND SO I DO NOT KNOW IF THEY WOULD HAVE TO APPLY FOR CONDITIONAL USE, BECAUSE THERE HAVE BEEN EVEN EVENTS OF BEING MORE THAN 800

SQUARE FEET. >> I AM NOT AWARE OF THAT. IT MAY BE MORE OF A SPECIAL EVENT TYPE PERMIT DEPENDING ON THE FREQUENCY OF THAT SPACE. BUT IF IT WAS A PERMANENT, REGULAR OPERATION UTILIZING OUTDOOR SPACE, THEN I WOULD SAY --

>> THEY DO NOT DO IT VERY OFTEN, MAY BE A COUPLE OF TIMES

A YEAR. BRODERICK? >> THANK YOU FOR THE PRESENTATION. THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD IS NEAR AND DEAR TO MY HEART. I HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO SERVE ON THE

[01:30:02]

BOARD FOREVER. I BELIEVE, SINCE THE BEGINNING OF TIME. SO I AM VERY FAMILIAR WITH THE MISSION STATEMENT OF THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD. AND I THINK IT'S NAME IT DEPICTS THAT.

HISTORIC PRESERVATION. HAVING SAID THAT, THE EDGARTOWN AREA, WE LOOKED SPECIFICALLY, THIS IS DURING YOUR TENURE WHEN THE REWRITE OF THIS CODE, IT HAS BEEN WITHIN THE LAST COUPLE OF YEARS. NOT SURE IF I WAS ON THE PLANNING BOARD THEN, REGARDLESS, IT STILL WAS REWRITTEN IN AN EFFORT TO STREAMLINE THIS, MOVING FORWARD, SO IT COULD BE CLEARLY ARTICULATED. AND THE BASIS OF THAT LOGIC WAS THAT EDGARTOWN IS UNDER DURESS FROM COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT. TO THE NORTH, TO THE SOUTH, WEST, EAST. AND THE PRINCIPAL REASON THERE WAS SUCH AN ADVOCACY TO PROTECT EDGARTOWN IS THAT EDGARTOWN IS ONE OF A KIND. AND IT IS PRIMARILY RESIDENTIAL. I BELIEVE THERE ARE TWO OR THREE COMMERCIAL USES IN EDGARTOWN PUTTING MAINSTREET ASIDE AS OFFICE USE, ET CETERA. IT ALSO HAD A VERY UNIQUE CHARACTERISTIC IN THE ZONING.

IN THE ORIGINAL ZONING. IT WAS ACTUALLY APPROVED FOR SHORT-TERM RENTALS THAT WERE APPROVED AS ROOMING HOUSES.

EDGARTOWN'S HISTORY OF RESIDENTIAL USE , WELL-DOCUMENTED IS NOT EVEN THE WORD FOR IT. LOOK AT THE STRUCTURES THAT ARE THERE. IT BECOMES VERY APPARENT THAT THE INTENTION WAS TO KEEP THAT TYPE OF USE. IT WAS THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD'S, AT THE TIME, THEIR INTENTION TO KEEP IT UNPROTECTED FROM COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT THAT WAS TAKING PLACE AROUND IT. TO, IN ESSENCE, BUILD A 10 AND CREATE SPECIFIC ZONING TO THAT SPECIFIC AREA. DELINEATED BY ITS PARTICULAR BOUNDARIES, TO PROTECT IT FROM COMMERCIAL INCURSION. OF NOISE GENERATION-TYPE OF FUNCTIONS.

THE 800 SQUARE FOOT, I AGREE WITH DR. FREEMAN'S COMMENTARY APPEARED AT THE 800 SQUARE FOOT INTERIOR AREA, I REMEMBER THIS CONVERSATION SPECIFICALLY. THIS IS A CRITICAL PART OF THE DETERMINATION. AND FROM THE ORIGINAL DRAFT OF THE EDGARTOWN ZONING, I HAVE SPOKEN TO THEM, IT WAS TO PROTECT THE SANCTITY, THE QUIET NATURE OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD, THAT IT IS A RESIDENTIAL ZONE. IF YOU WANT TO BRING IN COMMERCIAL USES, YOU PUT IN SOME USE OF THAT NATURE, YOU WILL HAVE A LITTLE OUTSIDE SEATING AREA TO SIT, IT IS 800 SQUARE FEET. THIS IS NOT A TON OF ROOM. OR IF YOU WERE TO PUT A HAIR SALON AND OR A PLACE WHERE PEOPLE CAN HAVE A CUP OF COFFEE AND SIT OUTSIDE, IT IS AN ANCILLARY USE OF THE PRIMARY FUNCTION IN THIS DISCUSSION. THE PRESERVATION BOARD, WHEN THEY GRANTED THIS APPROVAL, IN MY OPINION, IT NEGATED THE UNDERLYING INTENT OF WHAT THAT ZONING INFORMATION STREAMLINED BY THE CITY COMMISSION TO PROTECT THE SANCTITY OF EDGARTOWN. AND CLEARLY, IF YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE BUILDING AFTER BUILDING LOOKING FOR CONDITIONAL USE APPROVAL FOR ENTERTAINMENT AND THINGS OF THIS NATURE, IN MY OPINION, EDGARTOWN WILL NO LONGER BE A RESIDENTIAL NEIGHBORHOOD, IT WILL BE A COMMERCIAL CORRIDOR, AN EXTENSION OF THE DOWNTOWN BUSINESS DISTRICT INTO THE HISTORIC NEIGHBORHOOD, WHICH IS EXACTLY WHAT WE WERE TRYING TO PREVENT. THIS IS THE CASE STUDY AS TO WHY THAT ZONING WAS PUT INTO PLACE TO BEGIN WITH, IN MY OPINION. AND GOING BACK FOR YEARS, DEALING WITH EDGARTOWN APPLICANT'S, COMING FRONT OF THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD WITH SOME SORT OF COMMERCIAL ADAPTATION OF BUILDINGS THERE, THEY WERE DENIED. SIMPLE AS THAT. SO WHY THERE HAS BEEN ADRIATIC SHIPS, THEY ARE THINKING I CANNOT SPECULATE, BUT IN MY TIME SERVING ON THE BOARD, EIGHT OR NINE YEARS, IF MY MEMORY SERVES ME RIGHT, IT WAS OUR FUNCTION TO PROTECT THE HISTORIC RESERVATION AND THE INTENT OF THOSE NEIGHBORHOODS IN CONJUNCTION WITH -- AS DELINEATED BY THE FEDERAL

[01:35:05]

GOVERNMENT. THAT WAS OUR FUNCTION. THAT BOARD'S FUNCTION WAS TO ACT UNDER THOSE PROVISIONS. IN MY OPINION, CANDIDLY, THIS FALLS OUTSIDE OF THAT. I UNDERSTAND THE APPLICANT, OR THE APPELLANT, THE APPLICANT. THE OWNERS OF THE PROPERTY, THIS HAS BEEN IN OPERATION FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS. BUT STILL, THAT DOES NOT MAKE IT RIGHT. THAT THIS WOULD BE ALLOWED TO PROSPER. MAINSTREET IS AN INTERESTING EXAMPLE. BUT MAINSTREET IS NOT RUNNING LIVE MUSIC A COUPLE OF TIMES A WEEK. IT IS NOT A COMMERCIAL ADAPTATION OF THAT PROPERTY. IF THEY'RE LOOKING FOR A SPECIFIC FUNCTION, IMAGINE IT WOULD COME IN AND GET A PERMIT FOR A ONE OFF FUNCTION. IN A COMMERCIAL ENTERPRISE, CONTINUALLY OPERATING. AND I UNDERSTAND WHY THE APPLICANT IS LOOKING FOR A RELIEF TO THIS, SO THEY CAN CONTINUE TO RUN THEIR BUSINESS IN THAT FORMAT. I JUST FIND IT NOT COMPATIBLE WITH WHAT THE INTENTION OF THE ZONING IS AND WHAT THE MISSION STATEMENT OF THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD SHOULD BE. I BELIEVE THIS WAS A MISTAKE. AND IT IS UP TO THIS COMMISSION TO ANALYZE THIS AND SEE IF THEY AGREE WITH MY OPINION. I WILL BE BLUNT ABOUT IT. IF WE ARE GOING TO ALLOW THIS TO HAPPEN IN THIS LOCATION, THERE IS NO REASON WE WOULD NOT SEE THIS TO PROPERTIES DOWN INTO PROPERTIES AFTER THAT DATE AND THEN WHEN WE COME BACK, WE WANT TO SAY, GEEZ, WHAT HAPPENED WITH THE QUAINT RESIDENTIAL NATURE OF EDGARTOWN THAT IS IN OUR ZONING? BY THAT TIME, IT IS TOO LATE. I GET IT. I UNDERSTAND THIS ISSUE IN DEPTH, I PARTICIPATED IN THE REZONING, I EXPERIENCED THIS FOR MANY YEARS ON THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD. AND I AM VERY TROUBLED BY THIS DEVELOPMENT, WHICH GOES OUTSIDE OF OUR INTENTION WITH THE ZONING. I THINK I MADE MY THOUGHTS ABUNDANTLY CLEAR HERE. MY PERSONAL EXPERIENCE WITH DEALING WITH THIS ON THE BOARD IS WHAT GROUNDED ME IN CITY OPERATIONS. SIMPLY PUT, THIS WAS NOT THE DIRECTION IT SHOULD BE GOING IN. I GET I AM A LITTLE WORKED UP ABOUT IT BECAUSE I WAS QUITE BOTHERED BY WHAT THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD DID. AND THEY SEEM TO HAVE A LOSS OF THEIR VISION AS TO WHAT THE MISSION STATEMENT IS. THAT IS MY PERSONAL OPINION. I CAN'T SAY THAT BECAUSE I HAVE SET IN THAT CHAIR EXACTLY WHERE COMMISSIONER GAINES SITS FOR MANY YEARS BUT I UNDERSTAND THE MISSION STATEMENT INTENSELY.

AND WE NEED TO HONOR THAT HISTORIC PRESERVATION NATURE OF THE MISSION STATEMENT AND HOW THAT ZONING WAS CREATED. IT WENT THROUGH PRESERVATION, PLANNING, AND IT JUST GOT JETTISONED. I AM NOT ON BOARD WITH THAT. THANK YOU.

>> MR. FREEMAN, THANK YOU FOR THAT. LET ME BE CLEAR. THEY MADE A REQUEST FOR THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD TO GET A VARIANCE, THEY WERE OPERATING, TO YOUR KNOWLEDGE, AT THIS 800 SQUARE FOOT CAPACITY. IT WAS RIGHT ABOVE. AND I WILL ASK THE APPLICANT THIS. WAS THIS A QUESTION THAT I NEED TO UNDERSTAND FROM THEM ON THIS? THE QUESTION WAS ASKED EARLIER, AS FAR AS THERE WERE NO PLANS OF ADDING AN ATTACHMENT, WHAT WOULD THEY USE PRIOR TO THIS ENTERTAINMENT AREA OF 800 SQUARE FEET? I GUESS I AM TRYING TO UNDERSTAND. GO BACK TO THOSE PICTURES, PLEASE. YOU HAVE SOMETHING HERE YOU SAID WAS RIGHT HERE AT THE END. TRYING TO DELINEATE THIS ENTIRE BACKGROUND AREA, WHAT I AM LOOKING AT IS BASICALLY 5000 SQUARE FEET. THAT IS WHAT YOU ARE TELLING ME? AND THEY ARE LOOKING TO OPERATIONALIZE THAT WHEREAS THEY WERE CONFINED TO 800 PRIOR IN THE NOISE ORDINANCE THAT IS IN EFFECT?

>> THE RESTRICTED USE TO 800, I AM NOT SURE WHAT THE DEFINITION OF THAT WAS WHEN THE STAGE WAS APPROVED, WHETHER THAT WAS 800 SQUARE FEET THEN. I AM NOT SURE WHEN THIS WAS OPENED UP TO THE EXTENT IT WAS. WHAT DATE OR MOMENT THE 800 WAS EXCEEDED

INTO A LARGER AREA. >> THE PICTURE TO MY LEFT HERE,

[01:40:08]

IT APPEARS TO BE WHAT LOOKS LIKE A SLAB OF SOME TYPE. I

DON'T KNOW. >> LIKE A DECK.

>> RIGHT. OKAY. IS THAT THE 800 SQUARE FEET THAT WAS --

>> MAY BE. >> I JUST WANT TO BE CLEAR ON WHAT I AM HEARING WITH THE APPEAL. THERE IS A SPECIAL ORDINANCE IN EDGARTOWN THOUGH. OKAY, THANK YOU.

>> A COUPLE MORE QUESTIONS, MR. FREEMAN. THE STRUCTURES THAT ARE INCLUDED IN THESE PHOTOGRAPHS, ARE THEY CONSIDERED ACCESSORIES STRUCTURES?

>> SOME OF THEM, YES, THEY ARE ACCESSORIES STRUCTURES.

>> THE PICTURE ON THE RIGHT, THAT IS AN ACCESSORY TEXT IT IS NOT PART OF THE MAIN BUILDING?

>> THAT WAS AN ACCESSORY GRANTEDIN ISOLATION TO THE USE AT SOME POINT IN THE PAST. IT IS ALL THE SAME PARCEL.

>> CAN YOU BRING UP THE CODE FOR ME, PLEASE? I NEED -- OF THE EDGARTOWN OVERLAY, OR THE DISTRICT, I SHOULD SAY.

>> CAN YOU GO UP TO SUBSECTION D, USES ALLOWED? CAN YOU GO FOR ME, NUMBER THREE RIGHT THERE. WE DO NOT NEED TO READ THIS INTO THE RECORD, BUT I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT I AM UNDERSTANDING THE LAST TWO SENTENCES CORRECTLY. A FEW CUSTOMERS, IF YOU COULD INTERPRET THAT, PLEASE. JUST EXPLAINED TO ME IN YOUR PROFESSIONAL KNOWLEDGE WHAT

THAT MEANS. >> OKAY. THE DEFINITION ANTICIPATES THAT IT A FEW CUSTOMERS ESPECIALLY THE GENERAL PUBLIC CAN COME TO THIS USE?

>> THAT IS SPECIFICALLY REGARDING, THIS IS WHAT I WANT TO MAKE SURE I UNDERSTAND. THE USE AS THE CATEGORY TITLE ACCESSORY USES, WHICH WOULD BE THE ACCESSORY STRUCTURES I WAS ASKING ABOUT. IS THAT MY CLEAR INTERPRETATION?

>> YES. ALL EXCESSIVE USES MAY OCCUPY IT NO MORE THAN 20%. WE DO NOT HAVE THAT CALCULATION. I CAN ASK THE APPLICANT, MAYBE THEY HAVE SOME OF THAT INFORMATION IN THE LAST

SENTENCE. >> I THINK IF WE GO BACK A MOMENT TO LOOK AT THE CHART, WHICH IS REFERENCED IN THE DEFINITION OF ACCESSORY USES, THE CODE REFERENCES IDENTIFIED IN CHART A1 .1. SO ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT AND DETACHED GARAGE, IT IS LOOKING AT ACCESSORY USES IN TERMS OF THE ACTIVITY RATHER THAN THE STRUCTURE.

>> THANK YOU FOR THAT CLARIFICATION. SO IF WE ARE TALKING ABOUT USES OF THE STRUCTURES, WHERE DOES IT FALL? UNDER THE CONDITIONAL USE SECTION?

>> YOU WOULD HAVE PERMITTED USES. UNLESS THEY ARE ALLOCATED WITH THE CONDITIONAL USE, THEN YOU WOULD SEE A CONDITIONAL USE

APPLICATION THERE. >> DOES THIS FACILITY HAVE THE

PERMISSIBLE DESIGNATION? >> IF WE ARE CLASSING IT AS A GROUP, IT WOULD BE A CONDITIONAL USE IN ANY CASE.

YOU WOULD NEED A CONDITIONAL USE TO COME IN. IT WOULD ALSO REQUIRE CONDITIONAL USE TO EXTEND THE 800 SQUARE FEET.

>> IF YOU HAVE THIS USE COMING IN NOW, IT WOULD BE A CONDITIONAL USE ON ALL THE ASPECTS OF THAT USE, THE OUTDOOR ENTERTAINMENT SPACE, THE IMPACT ON THE HISTORIC BUILDING, THE IMPACT ON THE NEIGHBORHOOD , HOW THAT WOULD

BE CONSIDERED AT THAT TIME. >> THANK YOU FOR THAT. IF YOU COULD GO BACK TO THE PICTURES, ARE THE ITEMS WITHIN THE

[01:45:01]

PHOTOGRAPH, ARE THEY CONSISTENT WITH APPLICATION SUCH AS THAT? WHENEVER IT GETS BROUGHT UP. SALE SHADES, WHATEVER STRUCTURES ARE IN THE GROUND TO SUPPORT THE SALE SHADES, PICNIC

TABLES, CHAIRS. >> I THINK WHEN YOU WOULD BE ANALYZING CONDITIONAL USE, YOU WOULD WANT DETAILS LIKE THIS ON THE SITE PLAN. WHETHER THEY WOULD NEED A BUILDING PERMIT SUBSEQUENTLY, THAT WOULD BE A DIFFERENT ASPECT OF THIS. BUT ESSENTIALLY, YOU WOULD WANT TO KNOW WHERE THE SEATING WOULD BE. IF THERE WERE SHADE STRUCTURES, OBSTACLES.

OBVIOUSLY, WE WOULD REVIEW FOR FIRE EXCESS OR A.D.A. ACCESS.

THE NATURE OF THE SURFACE, AND SO FORTH.

>> THANK YOU, SIR. >> ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR STAFF? THIS IS YOUR LAST CHANCE. THE APPELLANT. THANK

YOU VERY MUCH. >> DID YOU HAVE A REBUTTAL? ARE YOU INTERESTED IN RESERVING TIME FOR A REBUTTAL?

>> YOU ACTUALLY MAY LEAVE THAT TABLE IF YOU WOULD LIKE. WE HAVE NO MORE QUESTIONS FOR YOU.

>> IF YOU COULD PUT UP THAT LAST SLIDE, PLEASE. THE ONE WITH THE WRONG DATES ON IT. YES, THANK YOU. THAT WAS ME,

THAT WAS ME. >> HOW WONDERFUL.

>> OKAY. NOW YOU ARE EXCUSED. I WOULD LIKE THE APPLICANT TO COME FORWARD. YOU HAVE 20 MINUTE.

>> CAN WE MOVE THE SLIDE NOW? >> MR. FREEMAN CAN COME BACK AND MOVE THE SLIDE. WE JUST WILL NOT BE TOO TEMPTED TO ASK

HIM ANY QUESTIONS. >> FAIR ENOUGH.

>> I WAS SENT 120 PAGES OF STUFF.

>> WOULD YOU STATE YOUR NAME FOR THE RECORD, SIR?

>> 12728 DRIVE. A LOT OF WHAT WE WERE TAUGHT IT WAS CONSENSUS ON THE CITY. THE MORE GROWTH, THE MORE WE WILL HAVE TO DO THAT. THAT IS WHAT WE ARE LOOKING FOR. AND ALSO, YOU KNOW, YOU ARE TALKING OF THESE THINGS TO HELP ENCOURAGE GROWTH IN SMALL BUSINESS, THERE IS A CHANCE TO KEEP A SMALL BUSINESS CONTINUING IN GROWTH. 13 YEARS AGO, I DON'T KNOW, 11 YEARS AGO, I GUESS IT WAS. SELFISH AT THE FORESIGHT OF TURNING THAT AREA INTO, AGAIN, EVERYBODY WANTED BUSINESSES THERE. FUNKY AND ECLECTIC. YOU GUYS WANTED A BREWERY, OR, YOU KNOW. SO THEY DID THE FIVE YEARS AND THAT WE ARE ON TO THE SIXTH. FOR THEM AND FOR US IT IS A CONSTANT BATTLE. IT IS SOMETHING HE HAS WANTED, THIS IS WHERE IT IS THAT THAT WE SHOULD. YOU KNOW, JUST CONTINUE ON TRYING TO KEEP A BUSINESS OPEN. THERE IS NOT EVEN A CIDER HE, THEY ARE CLOSING ALL AROUND. EVEN WITHOUT THESE LIMITATIONS, THE BIGGEST ONE IN FORT LAUDERDALE AND FORT PALM, THEY BOTH CLOSE BUT WE ARE STILL KICKING.

THROUGH COVID, FOR ALL OF THESE HURDLES WE ARE GOING THROUGH.

ALSO, IF YOU GUYS COULD LET ME KNOW, SINCE THE CITY, SINCE THE HISTORIC BOARD DID APPROVE THIS, THIS IS THE FIFTH TIME I HAVE BEEN UP THIS JUST FOR THIS PARTICULAR THING. NOT IN FRONT OF YOU GUYS, BUT JUST IN GENERAL. I DO NOT KNOW WHO FROM THE CITY, BECAUSE NOW THE CITY I HAVE, THEY ARE TELLING ME I CANNOT DO THIS. I WOULD LIKE TO FIND OUT WHO THAT IS. AT PAGE THREE, THERE WE GO. THE PROPERTY IS 4.68 ACRES. THAT IS OVER 20,000 SQUARE FEET. 8% IS 3.99% OF LAND. YOU KNOW, I AM PAYING TAXES, MAINTAINING THE WHOLE PROPERTY, WE KEEP IT CLEAN, WE KEEP IT NICE, IT IS A GREAT PLACE. SO BASICALLY, YOU GUYS ARE LETTING ME KNOW THAT I CAN ONLY UTILIZE 4% OF THE TOTAL PROPERTY, WHICH IS A LITTLE -- I WILL BRING THIS BACK UP 100 TIMES THROUGHOUT THIS WHOLE THING. THERE IS AN IMAGINARY LINE SOMEWHERE. IT WAS NEVER DEFINED BEFORE, DURING, THIS IS THE FIFTH TIME I HAVE BEEN HERE. NOBODY KNOWS

[01:50:02]

THIS INVISIBLE PENALTY BOX THAT WE ARE SUPPOSED TO STAY IN.

THIS BEING SAID, IF ANY KID IS AROUND, IT IS A VERY FRIENDLY PLACE. STEPS RIGHT OUTSIDE OF THE INVISIBLE LINE, A NEIGHBOR TAKES A PICTURE, WE ARE IN TROUBLE, CODE ENFORCEMENT. THAT IS IT. IF A DOG VENTURES OUT, WE ARE DOG FRIENDLY. THE DOG TEST USE THE BATHROOM. SO YOU ARE ALSO ASKING IN 800 SQUARE FEET, WHICH IS SMALLER THAN THIS AREA RIGHT HERE, FAMILIES SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO GATHER. AND IF YOU HAVE A COUPLE KIDS THAT ARE PLAYING, I AM SURE PEOPLE IN THE PICNIC TABLE RIGHT NEXT DOOR TO THEM MIGHT NOT WANT THAT. MAYBE THE PICNIC TABLES MOVE, WE HAVE A HALF-ACRE OUT THERE THAT WE ARE TRYING TO UTILIZE. I KNOW WE ONLY HAVE 20 MINUTES, BUT I'M TELLING YOU, I DO NOT KNOW HOW WE ARE SUPPOSED TO POLICE THIS.

I WILL GO INTO THIS A LITTLE BIT. I ONLY HAVE THREE OPTIONS, AS YOU GUYS ARE SHOWING EARLIER. THAT YOU CAN APPROVE THIS, GO BACK TO APPROVE THE 5000 SQUARE FEET, GO BACK TO 800 SQUARE FEET, OR MAKE YOUR OWN RECOMMENDATION. AGAIN, YOU WILL SEE LIMITING TO 5000 SQUARE FEET IS ON POLICE THE BOW. IT IS ABSOLUTELY IMPOSSIBLE. I WOULD HAVE TO PAY SOMEBODY TO STAND THERE TO MAKE SURE THAT NOBODY GOES OUTSIDE THE LINES. YOU JUST CANNOT DO IT. I EMAILED ALL OF YOU GUYS THIS. WE HAVE BEEN IN BUSINESS FOR SIX YEARS. EVERYBODY HAS USED THE WHOLE OUTDOOR AREA THROUGH THIS WHOLE TIME. AND HERE WE ARE STILL PITILESS BIT OF COMMON SENSE IS WHAT WE ARE LOOKING FOR. IF THE PROPERTY WAS RESIDENTIAL, IT WOULD BE AN UNLIMITED AMOUNT OF USE FOR THE PROPERTY. SO, IF YOU GUYS ARE WORRIED ABOUT NOISE WITH TOO MANY PEOPLE BEING AROUND, THE SAME WITH OVERLAY IN THE MUSIC. WHEN YOU GUYS MADE THAT DECISION TOO. WE CANNOT FIGURE OUT IF IT IS RESIDENTIAL, WHOSE TO KNOW? YOU HAVE TO MAKE IT ACROSS THE BOARD IN ALL OF THESE THINGS. BUT DURING THE CURRENT CODE, ANYBODY CAN USE THEIR RESIDENTIAL, THEY CAN HAVE A BARBECUE, THEY CAN DO WHATEVER. IF YOU GUYS ARE WORRIED ABOUT NOISE, THERE IS A NO IS -- NOISE ORDINANCE FOR THAT. SO IT IS NOT THE USE OF THE PROPERTY. BUT RESIDENTIAL IS ALLOWED TO GO OUT THERE AND USE THEIR WHOLE AREA. BUSINESS IS NOT. THAT IS NOT VERY SMALL BUSINESS FORWARD. DEFINITELY QUITE THE OPPOSITE. AND THEY ARE WANTING SMALL BUSINESSES DOWN THERE. LIKE I SAID, IT WOULD BE IMPOSSIBLE TO POLICE ALL THIS. 5000 SQUARE FEET IS UNDEFINED. AM I SUPPOSED TO PUT A STRING OUT THERE? OR A FENCE? AND THEN IF I PUT A PIGPEN OUT THERE, WHAT? WHAT IS THE USE OF HAVING ANY OF THE REST OF THE LAND? DO WE NEED TO GO OFF AND PARCELED OFF INTO DIFFERENT SECTIONS? CALL THIS PARCEL A, B, C, D AND USE 800 SQUARE FOOT OF THAT? IN PLAY THAT GAME? THAT IS CRAZY. SO PREVIOUSLY , YEAH. EVEN IF IT WAS 10 ACRES, IF THERE WAS 10 ACRES OF BUSINESS OUT THERE, YOU COULD ONLY USE 800 SQUARE FEET. WITHOUT A VARIANCE. AND TO POLICE THAT, IF I FOUND A PERSON FOR MINIMUM WAGE, AND WE ALL KNOW WHAT THAT ENDS UP LOOKING LIKE, THAT IS $12 AN HOUR. BASICALLY $15 AN HOUR TO PAY SOMEBODY. AND THAT WOULD BE $165 A DAY, 362 DAYS A YEAR, THAT IS HOW LONG WE ARE OPEN, THAT IS $60,000 THAT I HAVE TO PAY SOMEBODY. AND YOU DO NOT THINK THEY WILL -- AND YOU DO NOT THINK THAT PERSON WILL HAVE TO GO ON BREAK? I WILL HAVE TO HAVE SOMEBODY ELSE FILL IN DURING THE BREAK TIME LABOR WISE. AND YOU LITERALLY HAVE SOMEBODY PLAYING TAKE HER OUT THERE. IF SUMMARY STEPS OUTSIDE THE INVISIBLE LINE FOR A SECOND, A NEIGHBOR TAKES A PICTURE, I AM IN TROUBLE AGAIN. WHAT ARE THE FINES? AM I SUPPOSED TO PAY FOR IT? SO WHEN YOU ARE FIGURING THIS OUT, THAT IS WHAT I AM SAYING. YOU HAVE THREE OPTIONS. I'M TELLING YOU THE THIRD OPTION, DO NOT WORRY ABOUT THE 5000 SQUARE FEET.

BECAUSE I NEED TO KNOW WHAT THE FINES ARE, HOW THIS IS SUPPOSED TO HAPPEN. AND WHERE EVERYBODY ELSE'S 800 SQUARE FEET ARE.

THE SECOND SOMEBODY CONGREGATES OUTSIDE OF 800 SQUARE FEET, THEY WILL BE IN VIOLATION AS WELL. IT JUST IS NOT FAIR.

AGAIN, PAYING PROPERTY TAX ON LAND YOU CANNOT USE IS SILLY.

HAVING TO MAINTAIN IT IS SILLY TOO. IT DEFINITELY IS NOT WITHIN THE RIGHTS, I THINK A LAWSUIT WOULD BE EXPENSIVE FOR ALL OF US TOGETHER IF WE DO NOT USE SOME COMMON SENSE. RULING IN THE FAVOR OF THIS UNUSABLE SPACE WOULD BE CRIPPLING TO ANY

[01:55:01]

BUSINESS. SO THERE ARE A LOT OF BUSINESSES OUT HERE. ALSO, IF THESE ARE AIRBNB'S, THOSE ARE BUSINESSES. I FORGET EXACTLY HOW MANY PARCELS THERE ARE IN EDGARTOWN. BUT THERE ARE A LOT OF AIRBNB'S, THERE ARE STILL SOME MORE COMING. THERE IS MEAN STREETS, MYSELF, THERE IS A YOGA MASSAGE PLACE. THERE IS A MARINE ELECTRONIC PLACE. IT IS NOT JUST, AND THEN THERE IS A LOT OF MULTI-LIVING. LIKE THOSE APARTMENTS AND STUFF THERE. IT IS MORE BUSINESS THAN YOU THINK. AND AGAIN, SHOW ME WHERE EVERYBODY IS, SHOW ME WHERE THEIR 800 SQUARE FEET ARE. YOU GUYS DON'T WANT TO DEAL WITH THIS PICK THE RIGHT THING TO DO IS JUST TO ELEMENT THAT FOR EVERYBODY WHATSOEVER. YOU GUYS HAVE KNOWN THAT THIS HAS BEEN A PROBLEM FOR QUITE SOME TIME.

AND EVEN, LIKE I SAID, LAST WEDNESDAY, MAINSTREET HAD AN EVENT, YOU GUYS KNOW, YOU GUYS KNOW WHAT 55 DECIBELS IS. WE HAD TO GO THROUGH THIS. YOU GUYS WERE THERE. YOU WERE ACTUALLY THERE. YOU WERE LISTENING TO MUSIC LOUDER THAN THAT. KNOWING IT WAS MORE THAN 800 SQUARE FEET, AND YOU CONTINUE TO DO SO THIS WHOLE TIME. EVEN GOING TO THE WHOLE ORDER, THE NOISE ORDINANCE PART. YOU EVEN TALK TO THE MICROPHONE DURING APART WHEN IT WAS NOT LEGAL. WE NEED SOME HELP HERE. IT IS OKAY FOR THAT, BUT IT IS NOT OKAY FOR ME? THIS IS A WITCHHUNT. IT KEEPS GOING OVER, OVER, AND OVER ON ME. I HAVE BEEN HERE OVER A DOZEN TIMES ON THIS KIND OF STUFF.

HOW MANY TIMES HAVE I GOTTEN SIGNED? ZERO. YOU GUYS KEEP PUTTING ME THROUGH THIS. OVER, OVER, AND OVER AGAIN. AND I DID NOT WRITE THE RULES, BUT SOME OF THEM JUST ARE NOT RIGHT.

LIKE I SAID. EVEN WHEN YOU GUYS ARE GOING THERE AND YOU GUYS ARE KNOWINGLY GOING AGAINST IT. SO IF YOU VOTE AGAINST ME, PLEASE HAVE THE BACKBONE TO CALL ON ME. BECAUSE WE HAVE YOGA THERE TONIGHT. AND PLEASE CALL CODE ENFORCEMENT ON ME.

LET'S START THIS. I WOULD LIKE YOU TO DO IT YOURSELF, MAYOR, IF YOU REALLY BELIEVE THIS IS THE RIGHT THING TO DO. PLEASE CALL CODE ENFORCEMENT ON ME BECAUSE I AM IN VIOLATION. IT WOULD BE A GREAT START. YOU CARE ABOUT THE CITY AND YOU WANT THE ROLES FOLLOWED, THAT IS ONE WAY OF DOING IT. OR YOU CAN MAKE THE RIGHT CHOICE AND USE COMMON SENSE HERE. DURING COVID, SAME IDEA. WHERE DO WE MEET? OUTDOOR SPACE. WILL THAT HAPPEN AGAIN? LET'S DEFINE IT. WHAT AM I GOING TO DO ABOUT A KID, A DOG, WHATEVER. WHAT AM I GOING TO DO WHEN THEY STEP OUTSIDE OF THIS IMAGINARY LINE? HOW DO I POLICE IT? TAKE ALL OF THE BUSINESSES OUT OF THERE THEN. IF THERE IS A CORPORATION, TWO PEOPLE STOP AND TALK AND CONVERSE EIGHT, THAT IS IN VIOLATION. SO I REALLY DO NOT UNDERSTAND HOW YOU GUYS ARE GOING TO POLICE THIS. IT DOES NOT REALLY WORK, WE ARE A FAMILY FRIENDLY BUSINESS. IF YOU SCROLL THROUGH QUICKLY, LOOK AT ALL THE EMAILS THAT WE RECEIVED. I DO NOT BURDEN YOU GUYS WITH HAVING INDIVIDUAL PEOPLE EMAIL EACH AND EVERY ONE OF YOU LIKE WE DID BEFORE WITH THE MUSIC. HERE ARE ALL OF THESE PEOPLE. THESE ARE REAL PEOPLE, PEOPLE WHO VOTE, PEOPLE FROM THE CITY, PEOPLE WHO, TO OUR PLACE HERE.

I PUT IT ON FACEBOOK THE NIGHT BEFORE. I DID NOT TELL ANYBODY WE WERE DOING IT OR ANYTHING ELSE. WITHIN 18 HOURS, YOU GUYS PROBABLY DID NOT GO THROUGH AND READ ALL OF THESE. THESE PEOPLE, THE PEOPLE OF THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE, PEOPLE WHO COME SPEND THEIR MONEY, THEY SPENT ALL THEIR TIME DOING THIS. THEY WROTE ALL OF THESE. THERE ARE 60 LETTERS JUST WITHIN 18 HOURS. I DID NOT PLAY FANCY, I JUST PUT UP ONE POST AND I LEFT IT AT THAT. I DO NOT KNOW HOW MANY OF YOU GOT OPPOSED, A POST FOR THIS, I DO KNOW. THAT IS UP FOR YOU GUYS TO FIGURE OUT. YOU CAN TELL ME. LIKE I SAID, I HAVE NEVER RECEIVED A FINE. THE ORDINANCE AND LAMENTED BY THE HISTORICAL BOARD IS STILL GOING. AND EACH ONE OF ME, THESE ARE ALL PICTURES FROM THE CRAFT MARKET. WE HAVE DONE SO MANY EVENTS FOR CHARITY. WE ARE CONSTANTLY DOING THAT. WE HAVE WEDDINGS AT OUR VENUE. WE CANNOT PULL PERMITS FOR ALL THE STUFF. IT WOULD BE SILLY TO HAVE MAINSTREET PULLING PERMITS FOR ALL THE STUFF. I DON'T WANT TO DO THAT, I DON'T WANT TO THROW MAINSTREET UNDER THE BUS. BUT I'VE GOT TO BRING IT OUT INTO THE OPEN. YOU GUYS KNOW EXACTLY WHAT YOU ARE DOING. IT IS OKAY FOR THEM OR FOR YOU TO BE DOING IT, BUT NOT ME. IT IS OUT OF CONTROL. THE HISTORIC BOARD , THEY GAVE ME A 300 SQUARE-FOOT ENTERTAINMENT STAGE. WHAT AM I SUPPOSED TO DO WITH THAT? USE A 500 SQUARE

[02:00:01]

FEET OF IT? IF PEOPLE ARE STOPPING AND THEY TALK JUST BEFORE THEY GET TO THAT STAGE, VIOLATION. TELL ME HOW THIS IS SUPPOSED TO WORK. AGAIN, WITHOUT PUTTING PEOPLE IN A PEN. WERE DOING SILENT DISCO, WE ARE DOING YOGA RIGHT NOW, WE DO A PAINT AND SIP. ALL OF THESE THINGS. WE JUST CANNOT DO. I HAVE BEEN IN BUSINESS FOR MYSELF FOR 26 YEARS. MY JOB IS TO POSE THAT. THE MORE QUESTIONS, THE BETTER. BUT YOU GUYS KEEP STRANGLING ME WITH EVERY WHICH WAY. IN UNDEFINABLE WAYS. UNDEFINABLE. THIS HAS BEEN GOING ON OVER A YEAR AND A HALF. THE MUSIC THING TOOK OVER 3 1/2 YEARS, THREE YEARS OR SOMETHING. I MEAN, WE'VE GOT TO BE ABLE TO FIGURE THIS OUT.

I MEAN, IF WE WERE DOING FUNDRAISING, IT IS STILL GOING! THIS IS BAFFLING. AND WE JUST PUT IT OUT THERE. THESE ARE THE PEOPLE COMING TO FORT PIERCE. THIS IS WHAT YOU WANT. TO GROW WITHIN THE CITY. EVERYTHING YOU GUYS ARE TALKING ABOUT, THAT IS WHAT I'M DOING. I HAVE NOT GOTTEN FINED FOR ANYTHING. SIX YEARS I HAVE BEEN IN BUSINESS. IT IS OKAY, YOU KNOW. I APPRECIATE THE SPEED AT WHICH YOU ARE GOING, I LIKE THAT.

THAT IS HELPING ME OUT.

>> I WOULD LIKE TO -- >> IF THE COMMISSIONERS HAVE QUESTIONS?

>> THAT WOULD CUT INTO MY TIME. OH, YOU WANT ME TO POSIT?

>> YES. ANY QUESTIONS NOW? PROCEED.

>> NO PROBLEM. I JUST WANT TO UTILIZE MY TIME.

>> NO, I WANT YOU TO HAVE ALL OF YOUR TIME.

>> I APPRECIATE IT. LIKE YOU SAID , THIS IS ONE OF THOSE TIMES WHERE COMMON SENSE AND NOT POLITICS SHOULD BE APPLIED.

STILL GOING. THESE ARE THE PEOPLE THAT ARE FOR US. THEY ARE LOOKING FOR US. AND I HAVE BEEN VERY POLITE AND WITHOUT BEARING YOU GUYS, JUST TWO REAL PEOPLE THAT HAD TO SIGN UP AHEAD OF TIME . MAURICE AND BOB. IF YOU COULD COME OVER

HERE FOR A SECOND. >> THEY WILL COME UP WITH PUBLIC COMMENT. BUT I HAVE A WITNESS. THEY ARE GOING TO HAVE

A PUBLIC COMMENT? >> HE IS ALLOWED. HE DID LIST THE PEOPLE HE WOULD CALL AS WITNESSES.

>> I DID NOT KNOW THAT. OKAY, FINE.

>> AND I CAN GO TO PUBLIC COMMENT AS WELL. RIGHT?

>> IT IS A ONE TIME SHOT. >> OKAY, THEY HAVE THREE MINUTES IN PUBLIC COMMENT? OKAY. WE WILL WAIT ON THAT.

>> I WAS JUST GOING TO SAY, MADAME MAYOR AND COMMISSIONERS

-- >> MY TIME IS TICKING.

>> SHE IS PAUSING YOU. >> IF HE IS GOING TO CALL WITNESSES, THAT WOULD BE PART OF YOUR 20 MINUTES. IT DOES NOT PAUSE IF YOU DO CALL WITNESSES.

>> RIGHT. BUT THEN THEY CANNOT SPEAK DURING THE PUBLIC

SPEAKING? >> IS UP TO YOU HOW YOU

PROCEED. >> LIKE I SAID, THEY WILL NOT BE ABLE TO TALK DURING PUBLIC SPEAKING?

>> PUBLIC COMMENT IS FINE. >> THAT IS FINE.

>> IS IS A GET TO SPEAK, RIGHT? OKAY, PROCEED.

>> SAME IDEA. I COULD'VE BURIED THIS WHOLE PLACE WITH PEOPLE COMING INTO COMMENT. I LIMITED IT. I ACTUALLY TRIED, I TOLD PEOPLE NOT TO COME. BECAUSE WE DO NOT NEED TO BE HERE UNTIL 9:00 AND THEN PROLONG IT AGAIN. I AM TRYING TO WORK WITH YOU. BUT, AS I SAID, YOU GUYS ARE GOING TO BE ASKING, SO NOW IT COMES DOWN TO WHAT ARE WE ALLOWED TO DO IN OUR SPACE? EVENTUALLY, THE WAY THIS IS GOING, WELL, IT HAS TO BE WITHIN THIS AMOUNT OF TIME, YOU KNOW, YOUR ACTIVITIES, SO I'M SUPPOSED TO GET PERMISSION TO DO YOGA, TO DO A PAINT AND SIP? IT IS PEOPLE. YOU DO NOT KNOW EXACTLY WHAT THEY ARE GOING TO DO. I'M NOT SAYING EVERY SINGLE TIME, EVERYTHING A PERSON HAS BEEN PERFECT. THERE ARE PEOPLE UP HERE, WE HAVE ALL BEEN IN VIOLATION. WHAT I AM GETTING AT, IT WILL BE REALLY TOUGH IF YOU HAVE TO START TELLING US EXACTLY WHAT WE HAVE TO DO AND EXACTLY IN WHAT SPACE. IT GETS REAL STICKY, REAL STICKY. I WILL KEEP BRINGING IT UP. YOGA. WHAT ABOUT THE KIDS? THERE IS A MANGO TREE IN THE BACK. WHAT IF THEY WANT TO GO PICK A MANGO? THERE IS SOMETHING ON THE GROUND. IF MIGHT WHEN SKIPPING GOT STUCK AND TALK TO SOMEONE AND SOMEONE GET THE PICTURE, THAT COULD BE VIOLATIONS. I HAVE A CAMERA TOO. I HAVE BEEN UNDER ATTACK FOR 6 YEARS. I

[02:05:02]

HAVE NEVER FILED ONE COMPLAINT AGAINST ANYBODY ELSE WHEN THERE HAVE BEEN OTHER VIOLATIONS. I DO NOT WANT MAINSTREET TO GO THROUGH THIS EITHER. I LOVE THEM, THEY ARE GREAT, GOOD FOR THE COMMUNITY. WE ARE GOOD FOR THE COMMUNITY. IF YOU JUST KEEP READING THESE LETTERS, YOU WILL SEE HOW GOOD WE ARE FOR THE COMMUNITY. IT IS STILL GOING. IF I WERE TO HAVE KEPT THAT, IF I WERE TO HAVE REALLY MADE THIS CAMPAIGN WHEN I DID THE LETTERS, GOING AT THREE TIMES THE SPEED, WE WOULD HAVE FILLED UP WITH 20 MINUTES OF THIS. AND THEN THERE IS ALL THE PICTURES OF FAMILIES. AND I ASKED THEM JUST TO SHOW DIFFERENT AREAS.

IN THE HOLDBACK IS A SEPARATE AREA, AND HERE, WE HAVE TO GIVE PEOPLE ENTERTAINMENT, THINGS TO DO. A RING TOSS GAME, YOGA.

IMAGINE HOW MANY YOGIS YOU WILL GET AN 800 SQUARE FEET. LATEST YOU CAN FIND, IT DOES NOT WORK. SO I JUST DON'T KNOW. NO, I STILL HAVE TWO MORE MINUTES. OKAY. BUT, YEAH. I WOULD LIKE TO, OH, HERE WE GO. BECAUSE I DO NOT THINK I WILL BE ABLE TO TALK TOO MUCH. BUT, YES. COULD YOU GUYS ASK COLLECTIVELY HOW IS ANYBODY SUPPOSED TO POLICE IT? WHAT KIND OF BUSINESS DO YOU WANT HERE? WHY IS IT OKAY FOR RESIDENTIAL'S AND NOT REGULAR PEOPLE QUITE CAN THE BOARD ROLE IN WHAT WE DO FOR EVEN? LIKE WHAT KIND OF EVENT WE ARE ALLOWED TO DO? HOW CAN I BE THIS HORRIBLE OF A PERSON IF I HAVE NEVER EVEN BEEN FINED ONCE? YOU KNOW, SHOULD YOU LIMIT OR JUDGE, YOU KNOW, WHAT ANYBODY CAN DO IN THE SPACE? THESE ARE THE THINGS I AM WONDERING. IT IS AN ORDINANCE THAT DOES NOT -- SO ON THIS CLOSING PART, THREE THINGS. I EVEN SAID THIS DURING THE HISTORICAL COMMISSION MEETING. I SAID I WOULD VOTE AGAINST THE 5000 SQUARE FEET FOR THE REASONS THAT I DO NOT KNOW HOW TO POLICE IT. PICTURES ARE GOING TO COME. AND THAT IS THE WAY THAT IT IS. IF YOU GUYS JUST WANT TO BURY, IF YOU GUYS HAVE BETTER THINGS TO DO, THIS IS NOT SOMETHING THAT WE NEED TO SPEND ALL THIS TIME ON. BUT IF I HAVE TO START TAKING PICTURES AND MAKING THE FIELD EVEN, SO BE IT. I HAVE TOO MUCH STUFF TO DO. YOU GUYS DO AS WELL. YOU KNOW? THIS ONE MIGHT HAVE BEEN MISSED. I CLEARLY UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU ARE SAYING.

BUT IT IS UNDEFINABLE. I DON'T KNOW HOW TO POLICE IT. I'M SURE I WILL HEAR FROM YOU, I RESPECT IT, I DO UNDERSTAND. LIKE I SAID, WHAT KIND OF BUSINESSES DO YOU WANT HERE? YOU GUYS WANTED A BREWERY. BUT YOU CAN ONLY HAVE SO MUCH INSIDE. I DO NOT THINK YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT IT TAKES TO HAVE A BREWERY OR CIDERY TO KEEP OPEN. I SHOULD'VE BROUGHT ARTICLES AND ARTICLES. THIS IS EVERYBODY ENJOYING ALL THE DIFFERENT PARTS OF OUTSIDE. BUT ARTICLE AND ARTICLE OF ALL THESE DIFFERENT PLACES CLOSING. YOU VOTE AGAINST THIS, YOU WILL CLOSE DOWN ANOTHER ONE. I HAVE 10 SECONDS, I AM DONE.

>> THANK YOU, SIR. >> SIT DOWN OR STAND UP?

>> SIT DOWN, YOU ARE DONE. WE WILL ASK FOR THE OPENING.

>> OH, QUESTIONS. THEY HAVE QUESTIONS. SORRY. THEY DID NOT BEFORE, BUT NOW THEY DO. GOOD, GOOD. HE WANTS TO GO FIRST?

>> THANK YOU. THANK YOU FOR PROVIDING THE INFORMATION AND THE PHOTOS. SO I GOT A FEEL FOR IT. THAT WAS MY QUESTION TO TRY TO UNDERSTAND HOW YOU HAVE ACTIVATED THE SPACE. SO I SAW SOME YOGA, SOME PAINTINGS, PEOPLE JUST SITTING DOWN AND HAVING A BEER, I GUESS.

SPEAKERS ] DURING THAT TIME, WHEN YOU ARE DOING YOGA OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT, IS THERE MUSIC BEING PLAYED DURING THE

PARTICULAR POINT? >> NOT DURING YOGA.

>> OKAY. HOW ABOUT OTHER ACTIVITIES I SAW? ANY MUSIC BEING PLAYED OUTSIDE OF THAT PARTICULAR POINT IN TIME?

>> YES, WE ARE BACK ON MUSIC GOING SOMETIMES.

>> AND OF THE EVIDENCE WE SAW EARLIER ABOUT THE STAGING, IT LOOKS LIKE EIGHT TRUCK IS HER STAGE. RIGHT? SO HELP ME UNDERSTAND HERE. WHEN YOU DO HAVE CRAFT, CORN HOLE, WHAT POSITION OF YOUR PROPERTY ARE YOU OCCUPYING AT THAT PARTICULAR .2 OCCUPY THE PEOPLE THAT SHOW UP FOR THESE ITEMS?

[02:10:02]

>> DIFFERENT PARTS OF THE PROPERTY HAVE A BETTER USE FOR IT. DEPENDING ON THE WEATHER. WE HAVE HAD A WEDDING UNDER THE MANGO TREE, WE HAVE HAD A WEDDING ON THE STAGE, WE HAVE HAD A WEDDING IN A WHOLE DIFFERENT AREA. WE HAVE HAD THE CRAFT FAIR SET UP AROUND, WE DO OTHER FESTIVALS AND STUFF. WE HAVE A CIDER FEST. WE HAVE HAD A BREW FEST THERE AS WELL.

BEYOND THESE ARE THINGS THAT WE ARE TRYING TO DO TO PROMOTE AND BRING PEOPLE TO FORT PIERCE AND TO SHOW THEM WHAT WE MAKE. SO RIGHT HERE ON PAGE TWO OR THREE AT THE BEGINNING, IT WILL SHOW YOU HOW MUCH 800 SQUARE FEET IS, JUST TO SHOW YOU, I THINK IT IS -- UNDER MY -- YEAH. ALL THE WAY UP PAST ALL OF THIS. I THINK IT IS THREE OR FOUR. IT IS THE FIRST ONES WITH THE PICTURE. BUT YOU WILL SEE AN OVERVIEW. OKAY. THERE AT THE BOTTOM, THAT IS 800 SQUARE FEET ON THE PROPERTY. SO TO PUT IT IN PERSPECTIVE, LIKE, I AM SUPPOSED TO, AND I DO NOT EVEN KNOW WHERE MY 800 SQUARE FEET IS. SO YOU CAN ACCESS IT BETWEEN THE TWO BUILDINGS FROM THE STREET SIDE, OR FROM THE NORTH SIDE. SO IF TWO PEOPLE WERE TO STOP AND TALK, STOP AND HAVE A CIGARETTE, THEY ARE CONJUGATING, OR THEY ARE UTILIZING THE PROPERTY. IF SOMEBODY IS SMOKING, OUTDOORS YOU CAN SMOKE, SOME PEOPLE ARE POLITE AND WALK AWAY FROM THE AREA TO SMOKE. BUT THAT IS 800 SQUARE FEET. THAT IS WHAT YOU GUYS ARE ASKING ME TO WRANGLE PEOPLE IN. KIDS, YOGA, EVERYTHING. AND I DO NOT EVEN KNOW IF WE ARE SUPPOSED TO GO THERE, OVERBUY THE STAGE, IN BETWEEN. WHEN WE TOOK THE PLACE OVER, I HAVE MORE THAN 800 SQUARE FEET OF HANDICAP AREA JUST ACCESSING THE PLACE. AND IF SOMEBODY WERE TO STOP IN THAT AREA, THAT IS ILLEGAL AS WELL. IF SOMEBODY IS COMING OR SOMEBODY IS GOING, THEY STOP AND TALK, YEAH. THE FLOOR IS LAVA. SO IF YOU SCROLL UP JUST A HAIR, THE SMALLER PICTURE, YOU MAY BE ABLE TO ZOOM IN ON THAT, THAT IS 5000 SQUARE FEET.

IT IS A QUARTER OF THE PROPERTY.

>> OKAY, THANK YOU FOR THAT. >> YES, SIR.

>> ONE MORE QUESTION ON THE SAME PICTURES. WERE THE PICTURES GIVEN TO THE HISTORICAL BOARD WHEN YOU WENT IN FRONT OF THEM? DID THEY DEFINE OR DID ANYBODY DEFINED TO YOU 800 SQUARE FEET, 5000 SQUARE FEET? DID THEY TELL YOU WHERE TO GO? ANYTHING LIKE THAT?

>> NO. THEY PUT TOGETHER MY PRESENTATION FOR ME. THEY JUST SAID THIS IS WHAT WE ARE PRESENTING FOR YOU. I DID NOT EVEN GET TO PUT TO PRATHER -- TOGETHER A PRESENTATION.

>> THAT IS WHAT I NEEDED TO KNOW.

>> YES, SIR. AND THEY COME UP WITH OH, THAT LOOKS LIKE 5000 SQUARE FEET. AND AS I SAID, I WAS NOT ACCEPTED WITH IT. EVEN THOUGH IT WORKED MORE IN MY FAVOR, BUT IT IS NOT THE RIGHT ANSWER. I DO NOT WANT TO KEEP GOING THROUGH THESE MEETINGS.

YOU KNOW? >> THANK YOU, SIR.

>> YEP. >> YOUR TALK ABOUT 5000 NOT

BEING ACCEPTABLE. WHAT IS? >> THE ENTIRE PROPERTY FOR ALL USE. THE MARINE STORE UP THE ROAD, I MEAN, YOU WILL HAVE TO DEFINE, LIKE YOU GUYS ARE REALLY GOING TO HAVE TO GO THROUGH AND FIND WHERE THESE PROPERTIES ARE. IF SOMEBODY IS SENDING A PREP -- CONGREGATING IN OTHER AREAS, I WILL BE THE GUY THAT TAKES PICTURES FOR YOU.

>> YOU REALIZE THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE APPROVED THIS A LONG

TIME AGO, CORRECT? >> APPROVED WHAT?

>> THE EDGARTOWN DISTRICT. >> THE CITIZENS OF FORT PIERCE, 40,000+ PEOPLE APPROVED THIS BEFORE YOUR BUSINESS WAS IN

OPERATION. >> ABSOLUTELY. YES, SIR.

>> WHEN YOU MOVED YOUR BUSINESS HERE, DID YOU RECOGNIZE THERE

WERE LIMITATIONS? >> YES.

>> DO YOU KNOW WHY SAILFISH MOVED FROM THIS LOCATION?

>> A LOT OF DIFFERENT REASONS. ROOM FOR EXPANSION WAS THE MAIN

REASON. >> ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH THE HISTORY OF THE EDGARTOWN DISTRICT CONVERSATION WHEN IT WAS BEING PLANNED? HAVE YOU FAMILIARIZED YOURSELF WITH, YOU

KNOW, DISCUSSIONS? >> FROM HISTORICAL MEETINGS AND STUFF, YES. I HAVE HEARD, AGAIN, THIS IS WHAT I HEARD THROUGH THOSE MEETINGS. THAT IT WAS IN A DISTRESS, THEY WERE LOOKING FOR A MIXED USE OF BUSINESSES AND RESIDENTIAL. AND THAT THEY WERE TRYING TO BRING PEOPLE IN TO STRAIGHTEN THE AREA UP. AND THEY PUT A LIST OF THE THINGS THAT THEY WANTED.

AND A BREWERY / BREWPUB WAS INVOLVED IN THAT. AM I WRONG ON

[02:15:09]

THAT? >> I MEAN, IT IS FOR YOUR

TESTIMONY. >> I DON'T KNOW. THAT IS HOW I

HEARD IT. >> OKAY.

>> NO, I RESPECT THAT. THIS IS ALL PART OF THE PROCESS, BEING HERE TODAY. SO YOU ANSWERED A COUPLE QUESTIONS ABOUT WHAT ARE YOU LOOKING FOR? HOW DO WE POLICE IT? I THINK THAT IS AN OPEN-ENDED QUESTION. BECAUSE YOU DO NOT REALLY KNOW. RIGHT?

>> EVEN MY, LIKE I SAID. IT WOULD BE WELL OVER $60,000 A YEAR TO HIRE SOMEBODY TO DO IT. AND WE ALL KNOW WHAT WE ARE GOING TO GET WITH MINIMUM WAGE. AND THEN IF YOU WENT INTO AN OPEN AIR AREA, YOU'RE IN THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE, SOME HE IS TELLING ME THAT YOU CANNOT GO PAST THAT INVISIBLE LINE, WHAT KIND OF DRAMA WITHOUT CAUSE? AND THEN HE WILL BE WATCHING THEM? IMAGINE JUST BEING TOLD WHAT YOU CAN AND CANNOT GO IN A HALF ACRE OUTDOOR AREA THAT IS JUST OLD FORT PIERCE?

>> I UNDERSTAND. >> SO THIS PROPERTY HAS A CONDITIONAL USE, WHICH IS PROBABLY GIVING THE AUTHORITY TO OPERATE THE BUSINESS. YOU HAVE A BUSINESS TAX RECEIPT FOR

BUSINESS TAX FOR THAT? >> I DID NOT NEED A CONDITIONAL

USE WHEN I TOOK IT OVER. >> IT WAS ALREADY ON THE

PARCEL? >> THERE WAS ALREADY A BUSINESS RUNNING AND USING THE OUTDOOR AREA.

>> THAT IS FAIR. YOU KNOW WHAT THE ZONING OF THE PARCEL IS WITHOUT THE CONDITIONAL USE? IF YOU WERE TO JUST DO SOMETHING

DIFFERENT? >> RESIDENTIAL? I COULD MOVE IT TO RESIDENTIAL AND THEN I COULD HAVE AS MANY PEOPLE IN THE YARD

AS I WANT. >> ALL RIGHT.

>> I WOULD NOT BE IN BUSINESS, BUT I WOULD BE ALLOWED TO HAVE

A NICE GATHERING. >> WHAT SERVICES YOU HAVE AT THE FACILITY THAT YOU CHARGE FOR THE FACILITY, THE USE AND /

OR OPERATION? >> I HAVE NEVER CHARGED FOR A WEDDING. WE KNOW IT IS A COOL SPACE.

>> WHAT OTHER SPACES ? YOU HAVE MENTIONED A LOT TONIGHT BUT I'M NOT SURE IF THERE IS A CHARGE FOR THOSE OR NOT.

>> YEARS AGO, BACK WHEN WE WERE DOING MUSIC AND WE WERE ALLOWED, WE HAD A COVER CHARGE ON LOUDER BANDS. SINCE THEN, WE DON'T. ONCE TO TWICE A YEAR, WE DO A BEER FESTIVAL, OUR CIDER FESTIVAL AND WE BRING OUT NEW FLAVORS AND WE TRY THAT. WE DO A COVER CHARGE FOR THAT BECAUSE IT IS JUST FOR THE OUTDOOR AREA AND THE DIFFERENT FLAVORS. OTHER THAN THAT, WE DO

NOT CHARGE FOR ANYTHING. >> OKAY. OTHER SERVICES BESIDES HURRY OR OPERATIONS OF FOOD? ANYTHING LIKE THAT?

>> NO. >> ALL RIGHT.

>> THAT IS GOOD ENOUGH. I THINK I AM GOOD.

>> ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? >> I WANT TO BE CLEAR ON WHAT I HEARD. THAT YOU MENTIONED TO COMMISSIONER GAINES THAT THIS PRESENTATION WAS PUT TOGETHER BY THE HISTORIC BOARD. DID I

HEAR THAT RIGHT? >> THE 120, WHAT WE ARE ON RIGHT NOW IS ME. EVERYTHING ELSE AND EVERYTHING PRESENTED TO THE HISTORIC BOARD WAS PUT TOGETHER BY THE CITY. YOU KNOW HOW THEY PUT TOGETHER AND SAY, HEY, STEPH RECOMMENDS PER THEY ASKED ME TO TAKE SOME PICTURES OF THE OUTSIDE. YOU LIKE MY DRAWING I HAD INCLUDED, RIGHT? BUT THEY ASKED ME TO DO IT AND THEY PRESENTED IT TOGETHER FOR ME.

>> OKAY. >> I'M KIND OF GLAD THEY DID BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW. BUT, YOU KNOW. BUT THERE IS STILL SOMETHING, I'VE JUST GOT TO SHOW UP? I KNOW HOW TO MAKE CIDER, I KNOW HOW TO MAKE HAMBURGERS. BUT AS FAR AS THIS

STUFF GOES, NO CLUE. >> THANK YOU.

>> ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? THANK YOU, SIR. THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> OKAY. OKAY . NOW IT IS TIME FOR ANY OTHER MEMBER OF THE PUBLIC WHO WISHES TO SUBMIT RELEVANT INFORMATION TO US CAN COME FORWARD . YOU HAVE A MAXIMUM OF THREE MINUTES. EACH PERSON COMING FORWARD, PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS.

ANYONE WISHING TO SPEAK, IF YOU WOULD, LINE UP IN THE CENTER AISLE, PLEASE. AND THEN WE WILL TAKE YOU ONE AT A TIME.

>> AND STATE WHETHER OR NOT YOU HAVE BEEN SWORN IN TULSA. WE

DID SWEAR IN THIS TIME. >> MINIMUS HOLLY TONED, 419 22ND STREET, I WAS SWORN IN. FIRST, I WOULD LIKE TO CORRECT A COUPLE OF THINGS THAT WERE NOT REALLY FACTS THAT WERE STATED PREVIOUSLY BY MR. NOTLEY. THE REASON HE HAS NEVER BEEN FINED BY THE POLICE OVER HIS TENURE IN THE BUILDING IS BECAUSE, TO GET A FINE, YOU HAVE TO GET THREE CALLS WITHIN 24 HOURS. MYSELF OR ONE OF MY NEIGHBORS HAS PROBABLY CALL THE POLICE ONCE A WEEK FOR THE LAST, I DON'T KNOW, 58 WEEKS

[02:20:04]

SINCE THE APRIL DECIBEL ORDINANCE. SO THAT IS THE REASON THERE HAVE NOT BEEN ANY FINES. IF YOU LOOK AT THE NUMBER OF CALLS, THAT IS A DIFFERENT ANIMAL. ONLY BARS ARE LIMITED TO 800 SQUARE FEET IN EDGARTOWN, NOT ALL BUSINESSES.

SO THE SPOT IS NOT LIMITED TO 800 SQUARE FEET. IN THE UTILITIES IS NOT LIMITED TO 800 SQUARE FEET . AND THE REASON 800 SQUARE FEET, IT IS NOT VERY MUCH SPACE, AND THE REASON FOR THAT IS BECAUSE EDGARTOWN IS AN EVENT SPACE. IT IS A HISTORIC NEIGHBORHOOD. IF YOU WANT TO HAVE, YOU KNOW, A BAR WITH EVENTS AND HAVE LOTS OF PEOPLE, THERE IS A LOT OF LOCATIONS YOU CAN DO THAT. EDGARTOWN IS NOT ONE OF THEM. WHY WOULD THE HISTORIC BOARD APPROVED A STAGE IF THEY KNEW THE ORDINANCE ONLY ALLOWED 800 SQUARE FEET, ONLY UNTIL 9:00 P.M.? AND AT THAT TIME, ONLY UNAMPLIFIED MUSIC? THEY DID NOT KNOW WHEN THEY VOTE ON IT. THAT INFORMATION WAS NOT SHARED WITH THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD WHEN THEY APPROVED THE STAGE.

THE CITY EITHER WANTS TO HONOR HISTORIC EDGARTOWN AND MAINTAIN THE HISTORIC RESIDENTIAL NEIGHBORHOOD, OR THEY DON'T.

AND THAT IS PROBABLY WHAT TONIGHT IS ABOUT. WHICH WAY WE WILL GO WITH IT. IT COULD ALL GO COMMERCIAL, THAT IS AN OPTION. THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME AND THANK YOU FOR BRINGING THE

APPEAL. WE APPRECIATE IT. >> THANK YOU. WHO IS NEXT?

>> ROBERT LYNCH, 1830, SOUTH W HILL DRIVE, FORT PIERCE.

>> WERE YOU SWORN IN? >> I WAS.

>> YOUR LAST NAME AGAIN? >> LYNCH.

>> OKAY, THANK YOU. I AM SPEAKING ON BEHALF OF PIERCE CIDER WORKS. JUST THE FACT OF BEING INVOLVED WITH SOME 501(C)(3)'S. JOHN, THE OWNER, AND THE ENTIRE CIDER STAFF GOES ABOVE AND BEYOND TO HELP US WITH THE FUNDRAISING AND EVENTS AT THAT SPACE. AND I GUARANTEE YOU, WHEN WE HAD A SAVE THE SEAGRASS FUNDRAISER THERE, THAT PLACE WAS PACKED. AND YOU KNOW WHAT? DONNA HELPED US RAISE OVER $27,000 THAT NIGHT. AND AS A RESULT, INDIAN RIVER IS GETTING SEAGRASS PLANTED. OKAY? SO, I MEAN, IT IS A VERY GOOD IN A FIT. OKAY? THE CRAFT FAIRS THEY USED TO HAVE, MY WIFE AND I DO CRAFT. WE WOULD BE OUT THERE. THERE WOULD BE TIMES WHEN THE NEIGHBOR WOULD HAVE ONE OF HER FRIENDS, THEY WOULD BE OUT THERE ALSO SELLING AND SHE WOULD NOT HAVE HER PROBLEMS ON THOSE NIGHT'S. BUT ON NIGHTS THAT HER FRIEND WAS NOT THERE, SHE WOULD BE CALLING AND COMPLAINING. OKAY? SO THERE HAS TO BE SOME SELECTIVE USE. IS IT FAIR FOR A BUSINESS OWNER TO BE PENALIZED AND BE RESTRICT DID TO SUCH LIMITED SPACE? NO, IT IS NOT RIGHT. OKAY. ANY

QUESTIONS WHATSOEVER? OKAY. >> THINK YOU, SIR. WHO IS NEXT?

>> HELLO. MY NAME IS MARCIA DAVID. I LIVE AT 456 15TH PLACE

SOUTHWEST. >> WERE YOU SWORN IN?

>> I WAS SWORN IN. I HAD THE PLEASURE OF WORKING FOR PIERCE CIDER WORKS FOR AS A BARTENDER FOR ABOUT TWO AND HALF YEARS NOW. IT IS A UNIQUE LOCAL SPOT SERVING CRAFT BEVERAGES AND THAT IS KID FRIENDLY, DOG FRIENDLY, AND SUPPORTIVE OF THE ARTS. LOTS OF BEAUTIFUL THINGS HAPPEN IN THE BACK COURTYARD.

LIKE YOGA EVERY MONDAY AT 6:15 TONIGHT, WHICH I MISSED TONIGHT, OR OUR PAINTING CLASS, WHICH IS THE LAST SUNDAY OF EVERY MONTH RIGHT OVER THOSE MANGO TREES. OR OUR FOOD TRUCK FRIENDS WHO PARK ON THE PROPERTY AND FEED THE LOCALS WITH DELICIOUS HOMEMADE CUISINE, RIGHT OVER THERE. AND THAT IS ONLY SOME OF THE FAMILY-FRIENDLY EVENTS THAT TAKE LACE. I COULD NOT IMAGINE NOT BEING ABLE TO HOST THOSE ACTIVITIES ANYMORE. THERE IS ALSO JUST NO WAY, AS I STATED EARLIER, TO POLICE THAT KIND OF BARRIER. HOW CAN WE STOP FAMILIES FROM SITTING UNDER THE TREE WHEN IT IS SUNNY? OR A LITTLE KID RUNNING AROUND? DO WE HIRE SOMEONE TO STAND THERE ALL DAY UNTIL PEOPLE THEY ARE NO LONGER ALLOWED TO STEP ON THE LAND THEY HAVE BEEN BUILDING SO MANY MEMORIES ON? DO WE BUILD A WALL? WHO IS PAYING FOR THAT? WE HAVE A VERY SMALL FAMILY OF THE STAFF HERE. I CAN TEDID

[02:25:01]

NOT GROW UP TO BE A SECURITY GUARD. I'M NOT LOOKING FORWARD TO HAVING THAT AWKWARD CONVERSATION ALL DAY WITH CUSTOMERS ABOUT HOW YOU CANNOT WALK PAST AN IMAGINARY LINE OF DEMARCATION. AND NOW I WILL LEAVE YOU ALL WITH A YOGA --.

INHALE, EXHALE, FIND PEACE IN THE PRESENT MOMENT. HAVE A GOOD

DAY. >> WHO IS NEXT?

>> IS THERE ANYONE ELSE THAT WILL SPEAK THAT HAS NOT BEEN SWORN IN? DO YOU SWEAR AND AFFIRM TO TELL THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH?

>> YES MA'AM, I DO. THANK YOU SO MUCH. MY NAME IS KRISTIN STONE, COMMUNITY ADVOCATE. I PERSONALLY AM SETTING UP YOUR FOR A FEW THINGS. ONE IS TO OFFER MY SUPPORT TO NOT ONLY PIERCE CIDER, BUT FOR BUSINESSES STRUGGLING WITHIN THE EDGARTOWN EXISTENCE.

WE HAVE COME TO THE POINT NOW THAT WE NEED TO LOOK AT EVOLUTION. AND WHEN WE ARE TALKING ABOUT EDGARTOWN AND SAVING THAT, THERE ARE SEVERAL OTHER AREAS THROUGHOUT OUR ENTIRE CITY THAT I COULD DISCUSS, SUCH AS LINCOLN PARK.

AND TALK ABOUT THAT. SO I THINK IT IS REALLY IMPORTANT THAT WE ARE FINDING A HAPPY MEDIUM WHEN WE ARE LOOKING AT A 55 DECIBEL.

WITH ALL DUE RESPECT, WE NEED TO WORK TOGETHER. 55 DECIBELS IN MY RATE OF BUSINESS, BEING ON RADIO, IS ZERO. THAT IS ME TALKING. SO AT THAT LEVEL, WHEN WE ARE LOOKING AT THE 800 SQUARE FOOT OF HAVING THE OPPORTUNITY OF A BUSINESS IN THE BACKYARD, PROVIDING BUSINESS FOR OTHERS, INCLUDING EMPLOYMENT FOR OTHERS, BUT MOST IMPORTANTLY, A SAFE SPACE, I THINK IT IS SOMETHING THAT REALLY NEEDS TO BE LOOKED AT. I DO UNDERSTAND THAT MR. NOLLIE HAS BEEN AND HAS SOMETIMES BEEN A BIT CONFRONTATIONAL AND CERTAINLY NOT THE EASIEST , I DO, I AM TWISTED, I CAN SYMPATHIZE WITH THAT. BUT HE ALSO HAS THREE BUSINESSES HERE WITHIN THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE THAT SHOULD ALSO BE TAKEN INTO CONSIDERATION. HE IS VERY MUCH A PROFESSIONAL BUSINESSMAN WHEN IT COMES TO BUSINESS AND LOOKING LIKE HE IS LOOKING TO DO A LOT MORE BUSINESS IN OUR CITY AS WELL AS OUR COUNTY. SO IF WE ARE LOOKING TO PROVIDE THESE PROVISIONS OF OPENING UP, I THINK IT IS REALLY IMPORTANT THAT WE ARE ALL LOOKING TOGETHER SINCE WE ARE FINDING A REASONABLE SOLUTION. NOT ONLY FOR THE RESIDENTS OF EDGARTOWN THAT HAVE SUCH A VOCAL OPINION ABOUT IT, BUT IN ADDITION TO THOSE BUSINESSES THAT ARE ACTUALLY BRINGING MONEY AND CREATING A GREAT CYCLE OF HEALTHY AND OPERATING WAYS FOR OUR COMMUNITY AS WELL AS OUR CONSTITUENTS AND THOSE WHO MOVED TO OUR AREA. THANK YOU SO MUCH.

>> WHO IS NEXT? YOU WERE SWORN IN? OKAY, SHE WAS NOT SWORN IN.

>> YOU SWEAR AND AFFIRM TO TELL THE TRUTH, THE WHOLE TRUTH, AND NOTHING BUT THE TRUTH? THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>> HELLO, HOW ARE YOU? MY NAME IS MARTHA, I OWN POINT BREAK KITCHEN, WHICH IS A FOOD TRUCK IN FORT PIERCE.

>> COULD YOU SPELL YOUR LESSON FOR ME?

>> TARMAO. WE SERVE CHILDREN AND THE PEOPLE OF FORT PIERCE.

THIS IS OUR LIVELIHOOD. AND WE WOULD APPRECIATE IF WE COULD STAY THERE AND TAKE SPACE AWAY FROM FORT PIERCE CIDER. IT IS BEAUTIFUL IN THE AREA, WE LOVE SERVING THE COMMUNITY. THAT IS

IT. >> THANK YOU, MA'AM. THANK YOU

VERY MUCH. ANYONE ELSE? >> OKAY.

>> HELLO. CINDY O CONNELL. >> WERE YOU SWORN IN?

>> YES. I MEAN, EVERYBODY PRETTY MUCH KNOWS HOW I FEEL. I HAVE BEEN HERE A BUNCH OF TIMES. THAT REALLY ALL GOES DOWN TO, I THINK, THE MORE AND MORE THAT IS SOLD IN THE PROPERTY THAT DID NOT TELL HIM WHAT HE COULD AND COULD NOT DO, OR HE DID NOT DO HIS DUE DILIGENCE. HE HAS SAID IN THE NEWSPAPER THAT HE KNEW EXACTLY WHAT THE RULES WERE, BUT HE FORGOT. SO THE PROBLEM WITH THAT IS THAT I LOVE PIERCE CIDER, I USED TO GO THERE ALL THE TIME. I HAVE A BUNCH OF EMPTY CONTAINERS I WOULD LOVE TO HAVE FILLED UP BUT I CANNOT BECAUSE I AM IN THIS SITUATION. IN THE SITUATION IS THAT HE KNEW THAT HE WAS ONLY ALLOWED TO USE 800 SQUARE FEET WHEN HE BOUGHT THE PLACE. AND IT IS GREAT THAT HE HAS EXPANDED. HE HAS OTHER PLACES THAT HE COULD DO THIS AT, AND HE SHOULD DO IT THERE. THE FACT THAT HE IS RAISING THE MONEY, I MEAN IT IS ALL GREAT. I DO NOT KNOW ANYONE WHO DOES NOT LIKE PIERCE CIDER.

THE PROBLEM IS THAT HE IS ONLY ALLOWED TO HAVE ACOUSTIC MUSIC,

[02:30:03]

BUT OF COURSE THAT GOT CHANGED. AND IT WAS DESIGNED TO BE A SINGER / SONGWRITER, COOL HIPPIE VIBE WINE BAR, THAT KIND OF THING. IT IS NOT SUPPOSED TO BE CONCERT. IT IS NOT SUPPOSED TO BE BIG SPEAKERS COMING UP. HE PUT THE STAGE UP ILLEGALLY.

THEN WHEN HE GOT CAUGHT, HE GOT APPROVED. I DO NOT KNOW HOW HE GOT APPROVED. NOBODY KNOWS HOW THAT GOT APPROVED. IT DOESN'T MATTER. HE KNEW THE RULES BEFORE HE MOVED.. IT IS UP TO YOU TO ENFORCE THEM BECAUSE THE POLICE ARE NOT ENFORCING THEM.

SO, THERE WE GO. >> THANK YOU. ANYONE ELSE? ANYONE ELSE? OKAY. BRING IT BACK TO THE COMMISSION.

>> I DO NOT WANT TO REITERATE MY PRIOR DISCUSSION POINTS.

THIS IS A DEFINITION OF SCOPE CREEK. IT WAS MONITORED BY THE CITY. I DO KNOW WHEN SAILFISH ORIGINALLY OPENED THEIR, THEY HAD THE 800 SQUARE FOOT OUTSIDE WOODEN DECK AS THEIR OUTSIDE ENTERTAINMENT AREA. THAT WAS IT. WHEN THAT EXPANSION SUBSEQUENTLY TOOK PLACE, I BELIEVE IT IS A GRAVEL AREA, I DON'T KNOW. I CANNOT ATTEST TO THAT. BUT I AM GOING TO SPECULATE THAT AT THE TIME THAT SAILFISH OPENED AND HAD THE LOCAL PERMITTING PROCESS, THE PLANNING AND BUILDING, ET CETERA, THAT THE 800 SQUARE FOOT WAS DELINEATED. THEY PUT IN A DECK IN THAT AREA. THAT IS MY SPECULATION. AGAIN, ONE OF THE FOLKS THAT GAVE TESTIMONY MADE THE MOST IMPORTANT POINT OF THIS DISCUSSION TONIGHT. WE ARE EITHER GOING TO MAINTAIN EDGARTOWN AS WHAT IT CURRENTLY EXISTS AND WHAT ZONING CALLS FOR, OR WE WILL CONVERTED TO COMMERCIAL USE. AND THAT DECISION RESTS RIGHT HERE TONIGHT, IN MY OPINION. SO YOU KNOW MY PERSPECTIVE ON IT. EDGARTOWN IS A GEM, IT IS ONE-OF-A-KIND, NEVER TO BE DUPLICATED. IT'S PRIMARY UNCTION AS A CREATION WAS PRESIDENTIAL. WITH SOME MINOR COMMERCIAL ADAPTATIONS. AND RESIDENTIAL USES, INDICATED BY THE STRUCTURES AND BUILDINGS THAT ARE THERE, AND SUBSEQUENTLY, ROOMING HOUSES. THEY CALL THAT TODAY SHORT-TERM RENTALS. BUT THE POINT IS, THIS BODY IS CHARGED TO DETERMINE, WE WILL SAY, OKAY, WE WILL TAKE OUR HANDS OFF OF THIS AND WHAT THE TRADITIONAL USE IS. WE WILL PROSPER IN THAT AREA WITH A VARIETY OF COMMERCIAL USES OR DO WHAT THE ZONING ORDINANCE STATES? THAT IS REALLY WHAT IT COMES DOWN TO. AND IF YOU IF THIS IS ALLOWED TO CONTINUE, IT WILL BE OPEN SEASON OVER THERE.

THE CONDITIONAL USE REQUESTS COME IN FAST AND FURIOUS TO CONVERT SOME OF THESE OLDER STRUCTURES TO ENTERTAINMENT AREAS, AT THAT ARE UP. I GET IT, IT IS A VERY SEXY NEIGHBORHOOD TO PUT THOSE KINDS OF USES IN, THEY ARE GREAT BUILDINGS TO REDEPLOY IN THE COMMERCIAL REALM FOR CONGREGATING AREAS, ET CETERA. THAT IS NOT WHAT THE ZONING IS TELLING US TO DO. SO WE ARE EITHER GOING TO LIVE AND DIE WITH THE ZONING, OR WE ARE NOT. AND IF WE ARE NOT, I RESPECT THE DECISION OF THE COMMISSION. I PREFER TO GO ALONG WITH THE INTENT OF THE ZONING THAT WAS CREATED, NOT CURRENTLY. THAT WAS A REWRITE OF THE EXISTING OVERLAY. THAT OVERLAY HAS BEEN IN PLACE FOR MANY YEARS. SO I BELIEVE THE PROTECTION OF THAT NEIGHBORHOOD IS AT STAKE HERE. ARE WE GOING TO PROTECTED IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE LATEST REWRITE OF THE ZONING AND THE PRIOR CREATION OF THE ZONING? WHICH WAS DONE AT THAT TIME TO

[02:35:03]

PROTECT THAT NEIGHBORHOOD. OR ARE WE GOING TO SAY, ALL RIGHTS, WE WILL TAKE OUR HANDS OFF OF THIS AND ALLOW COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT TO PROSPER. THAT IS WHAT IT COMES

DOWN TO. >> IT WAS ORIGINALLY CREATED AS A PLACE THAT YOU COULD LIVE AND WORK. IF YOU HAVE A SMALL BUSINESS, YOU CAN LIVE AND WORK. IF YOU HAD A REAL ESTATE BUSINESS, IF YOU BAKED, WHATEVER. IT WAS RE-CREATING AN OLD-FASHIONED FISHING VILLAGE. YES, THAT WAS THE ORIGINAL INTENT. AND A LOT OF THOSE BUILDINGS WERE PRESERVED. IN FACT, PIERCE CIDER IS A HISTORIC BUILDING THAT WAS ONCE KERRY HILL'S PHOTOGRAPHIC STUDIOS. THOSE, THAT IS WHAT THOSE ACCESSORY BUILDINGS ARE. WHAT I SEE IS A VERY SUCCESSFUL BUSINESS HERE THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE LOVED. BUT UNFORTUNATELY, PERHAPS IT IS IN THE WRONG PLACE. OR ITS SUCCESS, BUT IT HAS NOT FOLLOWED THE RULES. SO NOW WE ARE FACED WITH A DECISION ABOUT THIS PARTICULAR ESTABLISHMENT , TO ALL INTENTS AND PURPOSES, IS VERY SUCCESSFUL AND A LOVE TO BUSINESS, BRINGING A LOT OF PEOPLE TO FORT PIERCE.

COMMISSIONER GAINES? >> I UNDERSTAND WHAT EVERYONE IS SAYING. BUT I HAVE AN ISSUE. I TAKE OFFENSE TO ANYONE YOU THINK THE PEOPLE THAT ARE SERVING ON OUR HISTORICAL PRESERVATION BOARD DID NOT KNOW THE RULES OR THE OUT LAY OF EDGARTOWN. I TAKE OFFENSE TO IT BECAUSE I AM PRETTY SURE THAT THE CURRENT MEMBERS ON THE HISTORICAL BOARD KNOW WHAT THIS IS WHAT THE TOWN WAS SET UP TO BE. WE ARE HERE TODAY AGAIN. WE HAVE CHANGED THE NOISE DECIBELS TO 55 JUST FOR EDGARTOWN. WE HAD THAT DISCUSSION IN FRONT OF US. I SAT HERE AND SAID, YOU KNOW, I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH JUST PUTTING IT FOR ONE PART OF THE CITY. BECAUSE I HAVE RESIDENCE IN OTHER PARTS OF THE CITY COMPLAINING ABOUT NOISE. AND WE DID NOT DO IT FOR THEM.

WE LEFT IT AT 65 OR WHATEVER. I ALSO HAVE A PROBLEM, SOMEHOW, I WAS NOT HERE WHEN THE LAND WAS PURCHASED OR THE AGREEMENT BETWEEN HIM AND THE PREVIOUS OWNER. I COULD NOT BE INVOLVED WITH THAT IF I WANTED TO BECAUSE THE COMMISSION IS A PRIVATE THING. HOWEVER, SINCE THAT TIME, SOMEHOW, A STAGE WAS ALLOWED AND APPROVED BY THE CITY. SOMEHOW , WE ASKED HIM, IF YOU WANTED TO CHANGE SOMETHING, YOU HAVE TO GET A CONDITIONAL USE. HE WENT IN FRONT OF THE HISTORICAL PRESERVATION BOARD. FROM TESTIMONY TONIGHT, IT WAS THE CITY THAT WAS PRESENTED TO THE BOARD -- THE COMMISSIONER CAME BACK AND ASKED THE QUESTION, IT WAS A CITY WHO PRESENTED THE INFORMATION TO THE BOARD. AND BASED ON ALL OF THEIR INFORMATION, THE BOARD GRANTED CONTAINERS FOR THE 5000 SQUARE FEET. HIS TESTIMONY, HE WANTED THE WHOLE AREA. HOWEVER, THE 5000 SQUARE FEET IS WHAT THE HISTORICAL BOARD PRESENTATION BOARD VOTED ON. NOW COMMISSIONER BRODRICK SAID THE INTENT, I UNDERSTAND THE INTENT IN EDGARTOWN. I HAVE NEVER STEPPED ON A HISTORICAL PRESERVATION BOARD. I DID NOT SEE IT. I READ THE EMAIL, HOW IT WENT ON. BUT THERE WAS TESTIMONY ON THE BOARD. AND FOR US TO SIT UP HERE AND SAY THAT NO ONE ON THAT BOARD KNEW THE INTENT OF THE EDGARTOWN DISTRICT AND REASONING WHY IT WAS CREATED, I THINK THAT DOES A DISSATISFACTION OR A DISSERVICE TO THE PEOPLE OF THE PUBLIC USE IT ON THAT BOARD. I AM NOT IN THEIR MINDS AND I KNOW THAT IS WHAT YOU ARE SAYING. YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT WHEN YOU WERE ON THE BOARD. I GET THAT. BUT WE ELECTED THOSE PEOPLE TO SIT ON THAT, NOT ELECTED. WE APPOINTED THOSE PEOPLE TO SIT ON THAT BOARD. AND NOW TO COME BACK AND SAY, WELL, I DO NOT KNOW IF THE BOARD KNEW THE SIGNIFICANCE OF EDGARTOWN. EDGARTOWN IS ONE OF THE MOST HISTORIC PLACES IN FORT PIERCE. SO THEY DID NOT KNOW THE HISTORY OF EDGARTOWN.

[02:40:02]

WE NEED TO ASK EVERYBODY ON THE BOARD, WHY ARE YOU ON THE BOARD IF YOU DID NOT KNOW? TO SAY THEY DID NOT KNOW, I JUST DO NOT BELIEVE THAT. THEY HEARD ALL THE TESTIMONY AT THAT MEETING, PRESENTED BY THE CITY. TESTIMONY TONIGHT, IT WAS THE CITY WHO PRESENTED THE TESTIMONY TO THE BOARD. AND THEY CAME BACK WITH THE DECISION TO ALLOW THE 500, THE 5000 SQUARE FEET. AND I DID NOT HEAR ANYTHING TONIGHT. SAYING WHERE THEY DID NOT DENY IT, YOU KNOW, BASED ON A, B, C, COMPETENT EVIDENCE, I DID NOT HEAR ANYTHING. COMMISSIONER BRODRICK HAD SAID, WELL, WE ARE GOING TO OPEN UP THE FLOODGATES TO TRADITIONAL USES, I DO NOT SEE THAT HAPPENING BECAUSE IT STILL HAS TO GO IN FRONT OF THE HISTORICAL BOARD, AND I HAVE TO PASS THE HISTORICAL BOARD TO SAY YES OR NO. SO THAT IS WHAT IT IS FOR. CONDITIONAL USE IS, YOU BRING IT, YOU TALK ABOUT IT, YOU PRESENTED. AND THEN THAT BOARD SAYS YES OR NO. AND THEN IT COMES TO US TO SAY YES OR NO. I UNDERSTAND WHAT IS GOING ON. THERE ARE A LOT OF QUESTIONS ABOUT THIS ONE BUSINESS. THIS ONE BUSINESS. AGAIN, I KNOW SOMEHOW HE GOT THE BUSINESS. SOMEHOW THERE WAS A STAGE PUT . SOME SAY IT WAS ILLEGAL. THEN HE WENT BACK AND CORRECTED IT. THE CITY CORRECTED IT. SO I CANNOT TALK ABOUT STAGE BECAUSE IT WAS APPROVED BY THE CITY. THEN WE HEARD FOR MONTHS AND MONTHS, WE HEARD ABOUT NOISE. OKAY. WE WENT THROUGH ALL OF THAT. WE HAVE AN EXPERT HERE SITTING IN THE BACK WITH THE DECIBELS.

AGAIN, WE MADE A DECISION. I THINK IT WAS A COMPROMISE BECAUSE SOMEBODY SAID AT 60, SOMEBODY SAID 55, I SAID 50.

>> WE MET IN THE MIDDLE. >> WE MET IN THE MIDDLE. I REMEMBER THAT. WE MET IN THE MIDDLE. BUT I ALSO KNOW THAT THIS NOISE PROBLEM, WE WOULD NOT HEAR FROM A NOISE PROBLEM TONIGHT, BUT IT IS NOT JUST FOR EDGARTOWN. I GET CALLS EVERY DAY FROM PEOPLE IN DISTRICT ONE ABOUT NOISE COMING IN THEIR BACKYARDS. AND THEY ARE STILL AT 60 OR 65. SO WE MODIFIED IT.

WE MODIFIED IT FOR 55. SO NOW I AM HEARING THAT THEY WANT TO DO YOGA, THEY WANT TO DO, YOU KNOW, WEDDINGS. I SAW THE PICTURES. AT FIRST WHEN I READ THIS, I WAS THINKING, I WAS ACTUALLY THINKING, IT IS JUST ME, THAT THEY WANTED THIS 5000 SQUARE FEET TO HAVE THESE BIG CONCERT. MUSIC WOULD JUST BE BLASTING EVERYWHERE. BUT THAT'S, IF YOU READ WHAT THE HISTORICAL BOARD SAID, IT SET UP EVENTS NOT TO EXCEED OR ESTABLISH THE 55 DECIBEL. THAT IS WHAT IT SAID. IT DID NOT SAY THAT THEY COULD GO HIGHER OR HAVE CONCERTS, HE COULD USE THIS PROPERTY UP TO 5000 SQUARE FEET. THAT IS ALL IT SAID. THAT IS WHAT THE HEARING SAID. A LOT OF PEOPLE SAID COMMON SENSE.

THIS, TO ME, THIS IS COMMON SENSE. THEY HAVE ALREADY HEARD THIS. THEY'VE ALREADY VOTED ON THIS. SO I AM CONFLICTED HERE BECAUSE EVERYTHING WE HAVE ASKED THIS BUSINESS OWNER TO DO, THE STAGE, GOT A COMPLAINT IT WAS ILLEGAL, HE CAME TO THE CITY, DON'T KNOW WHEN THAT HAPPENS, HE CAME TO THE CITY, HE GOT THAT WRECK DIVIDE. AMPLIFIED MUSIC, ACOUSTIC MUSIC, DECIBELS. HE AGREED AND SAID OKAY. I WILL KEEP IT TO 55. PART OF THAT IS BECAUSE I UNDERSTAND 55. YOU KNOW, YOU HEARD TESTIMONY TONIGHT THAT 1000 CALLS ARE GOING TO THE POLICE DEPARTMENT AND YOU HAVE TO HAVE 3 TO GET A CITATION.

THAT GOES THROUGHOUT THE WHOLE CITY. THAT IS NOT JUST EDGARTOWN. PEOPLE ARE MAD ABOUT THAT, I GET EMAILS ABOUT THAT EVERY DAY TO THE POINT WHERE I HAVE BEEN TOLD THAT OUR POLICE DEPARTMENT AND OTHER STAFF ARE TELLING THEM TO STOP CALLING ABOUT NOISE. AND I WILL ADDRESS THAT AT ANOTHER MEETING. BUT, YOU KNOW, WE REALLY HAVE TO TALK ABOUT THAT. HOWEVER, IT IS A COMMONSENSE VOTE TO ME. AND I AM READY, I THINK I KNOW WHERE I AM LEANING. I WAIT ON THE COMMISSION, MADAME MAYOR, AND

[02:45:01]

WE WILL GO FROM THERE. >> THANK YOU. COMMISSIONER, I FOLLOW YOU ON A COUPLE OF POINT. AND I HER TESTIMONY, I THINK WHAT TROUBLES ME THE MOST ABOUT THIS IS THAT THIS WAS ORIGINALLY A NEIGHBORHOOD BREWERY AND BREW PLACE WHERE THEY ARE SERVING CRAFT BEER. AND NOW WE HAVE TURNED THIS INTO A VENUE FOR OTHER ITEMS. AND WHAT IS THE MOST TROUBLING ABOUT THIS, EVEN FROM HIS OWN ADMISSION, HE KNEW, HE SIGNED A LEASE THAT SAID, HE SIGNED IT IN EDGARTOWN, WHICH HAS A SPECIAL OVERLAY DISTRICT THAT WE APPROVE AND WE SAID IF YOU ARE GOING TO BE HERE FOR THIS TYPE OF BUSINESS OPERATION, MEANING A BREWPUB, THESE WERE THE PARAMETERS OF THAT. SO YOU HAVE ALL YOUR INSIDE SPACE, I HAVE SEEN THE PICTURES, PEOPLE SEEMED TO ENJOY THEMSELVES. BUT I DO NOT KNOW HOW BIG THIS PLACE IS INSIDE. BUT PEOPLE MAY WANT TO GO OUTSIDE TO HAVE A SMOKE OR WHATEVER. AND, YEAH. BUT HE MADE A VALID POINT ABOUT IT. BUT I KEEP GOING BACK TO THE FACT THAT THIS TRANSACTION THAT HE ENTERED INTO WITH WHOEVER SOLD HIM THIS BUILDING HAD A CONDITION ON IT. AND THAT CONDITION LIMITED THE OUTSIDE DRINKING, CONSUMING, SITTING AROUND TO AN AREA OF THAT. AND THAT WE HAVE EXPANDED. THAT IS WHERE I GET CONFLICTED. I UNDERSTAND. YOU WANT TO SIT UNDERNEATH THE TREE OR WHATEVER AND DO WHATEVER. I GET THAT. AND IS THAT MAKING NOISE? PROBABLY NOT. MAYBE IF YOU ARE HAVING A CONVERSATION, IT GETS A LITTLE LOUD, MAYBE. BUT ONE OF THE CONCERNS WHEN YOU START TO ADVERTISE THIS, AND NOW YOU HAVE THIS 5000 SQUARE FOOT PIECE OF PROPERTY AND PEOPLE ARE COMING, THAT IS A CONCERN, NUMBER ONE. AND I JUST KEEP GOING BACK TO WHY DID YOU SIGN A CONTRACT THAT LIMITED WHAT YOU HAVE? BECAUSE IT WAS THERE FROM DAY ONE. THAT HAS NOT CHANGED. THAT HAS NOT CHANGED.

SO THAT IS WHERE MY CONFLICT COMES IN AT. AND SO BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, PRECEDENT IS SET BY LAW. AND IF YOU SIGN THAT, YOU KNOW, AND THAT WAS MY CONCERN WITH STAFF AND CITY. OF WHOEVER IS THAT LIAISON TO THAT BOARD, AS TO WHY DID IT NOT COME UP TO A DEGREE, HEY, BY THE WAY, THIS IS OUR ORDINANCES RIGHT HERE SIGNED BY EVERYBODY. AND THEY ALLOWED THAT TO GO THROUGH. AND WE ARE HERE RIGHT NOW IN THIS SITUATION. WITH ALL OF THIS BEING WATCHED AND COMMUNICATED BY. I DO NOT LIKE THE WAY THAT MAKES ME FEEL. I DO NOT LIKE THE WAY THAT MAKES US LOOK UP HERE. SO THIS, THIS IS, THIS IS NOT GOOD. AND I WILL HAVE MY CONVERSATIONS WITH STAFF. BECAUSE I KNOW WHO I APPOINTED TO THAT BOARD. I LOOK BACK AT THAT LIST TODAY, THERE ARE SOME VERY INTELLIGENT PEOPLE, THERE ARE SOME LAWYERS ON THE BOARD.

SO I HAVE GREAT CONCERN THAT WE'VE GOT PEOPLE ON THAT BOARD THAT EITHER THEY'VE GOT BAD ADVICE, OR THEY DID NOT FOLLOW THE ADVICE THAT WAS GIVEN. AND THEY EXERCISED THEIR LIMITED POWER AS A LOWER BOARD TO MOVE IT FORWARD. BUT THE BUCK STOPS RIGHT HERE WITH THE FIVE OF US.

>> COMMISSIONER JOHNSON, REAL QUICK. AGAIN, IN PUBLIC, THIS IS THE ONLY TIME I CAN TALK TO COMMISSIONER JOHNSON ABOUT AN ISSUE WITH THE BOARD. I HEAR YOU AND I UNDERSTAND, YOU ARE GOING BACK TO THE CONTRACT THAT HE KNEW IT WHEN IT WAS SIGNED.

BUT BY US, NOT US, WELL, NOT ME. I KNOW COMMISSIONER BRODERICK WAS. BUT THE ORIGINAL CONTRACT OR WHATEVER IT WAS, IT WAS AMENDED WHEN THE CITY APPROVED THAT STAGE. IT CHANGED EVERYTHING WHEN THE CITY BUT THAT STAGE, WHEN THEY APPROVED THAT STAGE, IT CHANGED EVERYTHING. SO IT TOOK IT AWAY FROM THE ORIGINAL TENANT OF THE PROPERTY BECAUSE HE BUILT A STAGE, SOME SAY ILLEGAL, SOMETHING NOT ILLEGAL. I DON'T KNOW. I WAS NOT HERE. BUT I DO KNOW THAT ONCE THE CITY FOUND OUT, HE CAME IN FRONT OF THIS BOARD, OR A BOARD, AND THE STAGE WAS APPROVED. SO AT THAT POINT, AT THAT POINT, THE ORIGINAL INTENT OF THE WHOLE CONTRACT AND AREA CHANGED.

[02:50:03]

BECAUSE THAT WAS NOT PART. THERE WAS NO STAGE THERE WHEN HE SIGNED THE CONTRACT. AND THE CITY COULD HAVE STOPPED IT THEN. BUT WE DID NOT. SO NOW WE LET THEM PUT A STAGE IN, WE HAVE ASKED HIM TO LOWER THE STUFF, AND NOW WE ARE COMING BACK SAYING, WELL, WE WANT TO TAKE IT ALL THE WAY BACK TO THE INTENT OF THE SALE. I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT BECAUSE THE CITY ALLOWED THIS TO GO ON FOR SO LONG. AND, I GUESS, WE WERE HOPING, OR SOMEBODY WAS HOPING THAT THE HISTORIC BOARD WOULD HAVE SAID NO, THEY DID NOT. SO THAT IS MY CONCERN OVER HERE.

BECAUSE THE CITY, LIKE I SAID, IT MAKES US ALL LOOK BAD, WHATEVER, THIS WHOLE THING. BUT THE CITY HAD A PART IN THIS BECAUSE THEY APPROVED THAT STAGE, WHICH CREATED THE WHOLE ISSUES WITH THE MUSIC, THE DECIBELS, AND EVERYTHING ELSE WE HAVE BEEN THROUGH. WE APPROVED THAT. SOME BOARD APPROVED THAT. SO I DO NOT KNOW IF THAT HAD TO GO THROUGH THE HISTORIC BOARD, PLANNING BOARD, OR WHATEVER. I KNOW WHEN IT CAME TO THE CITY COMMISSION , AND WHATEVER WAS PRESENTED THAT NIGHT, IT WAS APPROVED. SO THAT IS THE PROBLEM I HAD WHEN GOING BACK TO THE ORIGINAL SALE AND HIM CHANGING OR SAYING HE IS TRYING TO CHANGE WHATEVER. AT THAT POINT, WE COULD'VE SAID, HEY, THIS WAS NOT THE ORIGINAL INTENT, OR MAYBE IT WAS SAID THEN AND IT WAS STILL APPROVED. SO THAT IS WHERE I AM GOING.

MR. BRODRICK, YOU ARE TAKING HER HEAD. THAT IS NOT HOW IT WENT, CORRECT ME. THIS IS THE ONLY TIME I CAN TALK TO YOU.

BUT I, JUST KNOW THAT THERE WAS NO TRUCK THERE WITH A STAGE

THERE WHEN HE BOUGHT IT. >> FORTUNATELY OR UNFORTUNATELY, I AM THE ONLY PERSON ELECTED FROM CITY STAFF.

IT GOES BACK MANY YEARS. ONE OF THE FOLKS THAT SPOKE EARLIER DIRECTED THE COMMENT TO ME THAT I WAS THERE, AND I WAS.

>> IT IS A PUBLIC RECORD. YOU CAN GO BACK TO THE MEETING AND CALL IT UP. I WILL TELL YOU PRECISELY WHAT MY RECOLLECTION IS. I'M NOT SPEAKING FROM THE RECORD. BUT MY RECOLLECTION IS THIS. AT THAT MEETING, THE APPLICANT CAME FORWARD WITH THE CONCEPT OF A STAGE. ON THIS ANTIQUE TRUCK. IT WAS PRESENTED TO THE HISTORIC CHRISTIAN -- PRESERVATION BOARD BY THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION OFFICER IN THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT.

THERE WAS NO MENTION OR DISCUSSION OF A DISCUSSION OF 800 SQUARE FEET OF OUTSIDE ENTERTAINMENT OR USE AREA.

HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD WAS NOT MADE AWARE OF THAT, IN MY UKRAINIAN -- OPINION, CRITICAL INFORMATION. THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD UNWITTINGLY, NOT KNOWING THAT THIS RAN CONTRARY TO WHAT THE ORDINANCE STATED , THEY APPROVED THAT STAGE. MY RECOLLECTION OF THAT MEETING, IT COULD HAVE BEEN A MUCH MORE LENGTHY DISCUSSION. THE PERSON I GAVE TESTIMONY EARLIER ALSO SET ON THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD AT THE TIME, RECOLLECTS THE SAME DISCUSSION THAT I RECALL.

>> COMMISSIONER, I HEAR YOU. BUT YOU ARE CORRECT. WHATEVER WAS DONE AT THE HISTORICAL PRESERVATION BOARD ABOUT THAT STAGE, WHATEVER DECISION WAS MADE, I DO NOT CARE WHAT WAS SAID DURING THAT MEETING. IT WAS APPROVED. AND IT CAME BACK

TO THIS BOARD -- >> I DON'T THINK IT DID.

>> HOW? >> THAT BOARD HAS QUASIJUDICIAL AUTHORITY TO APPROVE, I AM NOTHING IF ACTUALLY DID NOT COME TO THE COMMISSION, BUT I AM 99% SURE THAT THE DECISION WAS A STEMMED DECISION THAT THE BOARD HAD THE LATITUDE TO MAKE.

HOWEVER, THEY MADE THE DECISION IN A VACUUM OF INFORMATION AND DID NOT HAVE PERTINENT FACTS TO MAKE THAT DECISION. THAT FALLS ON THE CITY AND IT FALLS ON US. THAT GOES BACK YEARS AGO THAT THE DECISION WAS MADE. NOBODY, THIS WAS NOT UNDER FREEMAN'S DIRECTION IT WAS NOT UNDER CITY ATTORNEY HEDGE'S DECISION AT THAT TIME. AND THAT BOARD WAS ACTUALLY REPRESENTED, BECAUSE IT IS QUASIJUDICIAL, BY THE CITY ATTORNEY.

>> THERE IS A LITTLE BIT OF DIALOGUE GOING ON. I WANT TO SEE IF WE GET THE COMMISSIONER J. JOHNSON IN HERE.

>> THERE WAS AN ATTORNEY PRESENT AT THE MEETING WHEN THE DETERMINATION WAS MADE. SIMPLE AS THAT.

>> THAT WAS MY POINT. GO AHEAD, MADAME MAYOR. I WANT TO GET

[02:55:03]

COMMISSIONER J. JOHNSON IN HERE. HAVE YOU HAD A CHANCE TO

SPEAK GET REX >> MA'AM, THIS IS ALL GOOD CONVERSATION. AND I WILL BE BRIEF. AND I WILL TALK ABOUT THE STAGE FIRST. THE STAGE IS JUST THAT, IT IS A STAGE. IT -- GOES IN FRONT OF THE STAGE AND VIOLATE THE 800 SQUARE FEET.

FOR ALL I KNOW, THE STAGE MEANT THAT THERE WAS ONE PERSON ON THE STAGE TURNING OVER LETTERS AND THEY WERE HAVING A GAME OF WHEEL OF FORTUNE AND THEY COULD HAVE THE OUTDOOR SPACE AT 400 SQUARE FEET AND HAVE 400 SQUARE FEET BY THE BUILDING AND THEY WOULD NOT BE IN VIOLATION. THE POINT IS, I DO NOT THINK THE STAGE IN THE USE OF THE STAGE COMING INTO PLAY WITH THE APPROVAL OF THE STAGE. AND THEN IT IS UP TO THE PARCEL OWNER TO ADHERE TO THE RULES IN WHICH THEY KNOW THAT THEIR LAND IS UNDER THIS SET OF RULES. SO WHAT I HAVE NOT HEARD, WHETHER IT IS FROM MINUTES OF FORMER COMMISSION MEETINGS, PLANNING BOARD MEETINGS, I HAVE NOT READ ABOUT IT, I HAVEN'T HEARD TESTIMONY ABOUT IT, OF WHY WE SHOULD SWITCH WITH WHAT HAS BEEN APPEALED TONIGHT. I DID NOT HEAR ANY FACTUAL INFORMATION CONVEYED TO US THAT WOULD OVERRULE THE DECISION MADE BY THE CITIZENS OF THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE IN 2012 WHEN THE CITY WAS APPROVED. I THINK THERE ARE 30 PARCELS, 34 PARCELS, SOMETHING LIKE THAT. IN EDGARTOWN. WE HAVE SPENT A LIFETIME OF MEETINGS, AND A LIFETIME OF MEETING MINUTES SITTING HERE TALKING ABOUT A SMALL DISTRICT WITHIN THE BOUNDARIES OF THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE, WHICH HAS TENS OF SQUARE MILES TO WORRY ABOUT. 48,000 PEOPLE TO WORRY ABOUT.

AND I NOTHING THAT NO ONE HAS A RIGHT TO DO THAT, THEY DO HAVE THE RIGHT TO DO THAT, I AM OKAY WITH THAT. AND I THINK IT IS OUR JOB TO LISTEN TO THOSE APPEALS AND THE CONCERNS, AND THE APPLICATION. BUT IF YOU GO BACK AND YOU TRULY LOOK AT ALL OF THE MINUTES AND ALL OF THE INFORMATION OF WHAT THIS DISTRICT WAS SET UP TO BE, I THINK THAT IS VERY FACTUAL AND VERY RELEVANT. I LOOK BACK AT WHERE I WAS GOING WITH THE VTR.

WHAT IS GOING ON THE PROPERTY? COMMISSIONER C. JOHNSON BROUGHT THAT UP. IT IS IT A BREWPUB? IT IS, ACCORDING TO THE CODE.

THERE ARE PARAMETERS FOR THIS ACTIVITY IS LIMITED SQUARE FOOT SECOND WITHIN THE FACILITY AND OUTSIDE OF THE FACILITY. AND I HAVE HEARD TESTIMONY IN FRONT OF ALL OF THOSE DETAILS. WHEN I GO BACK TO THE DISTRICT AND I LOOK AT ALL THE CHARACTERISTICS AND HOW THIS DISTRICT WAS SET UP, THERE ARE VARIOUS STRATEGIC STANDARD WHICH I THINK APPLY IN A VERY APPROPRIATE WAY. I EVEN ASKED THE APPLICANT. WHAT IF THERE WAS A CHANGE IN THE USE OF THE BUILDING? IT COULD BE RESIDENTIAL. AND HE EVEN TESTIFIED, IT COULD BE ANOTHER BUSINESS WITH PERMISSIBLE USE WITHIN THE CODE. YOU KNOW, THIS IS A CHALLENGE OF LOCATION.

THIS IS A CHALLENGE OF AN OPPORTUNITY, AN ENTREPRENEUR WITHIN OUR CITY THAT I HAVE VISITED, I HAVE VISITED THE PARCEL. BUT WHEN IT COMES DOWN TO THE CODE, THE CODE IS A CODE. I AM CHALLENGED BY THAT. AND I AM LOOKING AT THE RULE OF WHAT IS IN FRONT OF US. AND I DO NOT SEE WHERE WE CAN CHANGE THAT CODE WITHOUT A TOTAL REWRITE OF THE EDGARTOWN DISTRICT. IF WE WANT TO GO TO THE EDGARTOWN DISTRICT, MAYBE MY MIND COULD BE MADE IN A DIFFERENT WAY. WHEN YOU GO PARCEL BY PARCEL, WE ARE GOING TO HAVE CHALLENGES, SUCH AS A BUSINESS OF THIS TYPE WITH OUTDOOR ENTERTAINMENT OF SOME VALUE, SOME NOISE LEVEL. WITH HISTORIC STRUCTURES THAT WE KNOW ARE NOT BUILT IN TODAY'S FLORIDA BUILDING CODE. IT ALSO MEANS THE WALLS ARE THINNER, GLASSES COULD BE THINNER. THEY MAY OR MAY NOT HAVE BEEN RENOVATED. IT MAY HAVE BEEN UPGRADED TO ADDITIONAL SOUND FOR IMAGING PARAMETERS TO BE GOOD NEIGHBORS, BAD NEIGHBORS, WHATEVER IT IS. THOSE ARE ALSO TOURS -- ACCOUNTED FOR IN THIS DISTRICT. I HAVE NOT HEARD

[03:00:02]

TESTIMONY THAT CAN LEND ME TO CHANGE TO THE RECOMMENDATION OF THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD. AND FOR ME, WELL , I DO NOT SEE HOW I COULD CHANGE IT TO THEIR RECOMMENDATION OR APPROVAL, ACTUALLY. IT WAS APPROVAL, NOT EVEN

RECOMMENDATION. >> THE ONLY THING I WOULD POINT OUT IS THAT YOU ARE ALLOWED TO HAVE A CONDITIONAL USE. YOU ARE ALLOWED TO APPEAL THE 800 AND ASK FOR MORE. AND THAT IS WHAT THEY DID. SO, TO ME, THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT YOU HAVE TO REWRITE THE CODE. THIS IS CONDITIONAL USE.

>> CONDITIONAL USE TO USE 5000 SQUARE FEET AT THAT PROPERTY.

>> YES, YES. >> CAN I ASK A QUESTION HERE? COMMISSIONER GAINES, YOU MAKE A COMPELLING ARGUMENT. I'M NOT GETTING ON BOARD WITH YOUR ARGUMENT, BUT IT IS A COMPELLING ARGUMENT. WHERE YOU GOING IN THAT DIRECTION? I DO NOT THINK YOU COMPLETED THE THOUGHTS, OR I DID NOT PICK UP ON IT. YOU INDICATED THAT BASED ON THE ACTIONS OF THE PRIOR HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD TO APPROVE THE STAGE, THAT IS PRECEDENCE TO MAINTAIN THE 5000 SQUARE FEET. IS THAT YOUR

CONCLUSION? >> COMMISSIONER BARDEN, MY CONCLUSION IS THAT THE RULES IN THIS AREA IN EDGARTOWN STATE THAT TO USE OR GET A CONDITIONAL USE, THEY VOTED ON IT. AND YOU HAVE TO PRESENT THAT TO THE BOARD AND THE BOARD APPROVED IT. YOU TAUGHT ME SOMETHING TONIGHT. AND IT DID NOT COME IN FRONT OF US. I FORGOT THEY HAVE THE QUASIJUDICIAL APPROVAL TO GO. THIS IS THE SAME THING. HE WANTED CONDITIONAL USE SO HE DID NOT DO IT. HE APPLIED FOR CONDITIONAL USE, HE WENT IN FRONT OF THE BOARD FOR THAT CONDITIONAL USE. THE HISTORICAL BOARD AND SAID 5000 SQUARE FEET. WE WILL GIVE YOU 5000 SQUARE FEET. WE WILL NOT GIVE YOU THE HOLDUP PROPERTY, WE WILL GIVE YOU 5000 SQUARE FEET.

SO THEN THAT IS WHAT THEY APPROVED. IF YOU GO BACK AND READ IT, IT SAID NOT TO GO OVER ANY NOISE ABOVE THE NOISE ORDINANCE. SO THIS IS A REQUEST FOR A CONDITIONAL USE WHICH WAS APPROVED BY A HISTORICAL BOARD. HE TESTIFIED HE WANTED THE

WHOLE AREA. >> SO THIS IS A MISUNDERSTANDIN G THERE? THE MISUNDERSTANDING IS THAT THE 5000 SQUARE FOOT NUMBER WAS PRODUCED BY STAFF GOING OUT AND DOING FIELD MEASUREMENTS. THAT IS WHERE THE NUMBER CAME FROM, TO THE BACKYARD AREA ENCOMPASSING 5000 SQUARE FEET. NOT I HAVE 10,000 SQUARE FEET THAT I WANT TO DEDICATE TO THIS, BUT STEPH MEASURED THE AREA THAT IS BEING ACTIVELY USED AS AN ENTERTAINMENT AREA AND DETERMINED IT WAS A 5000 SQUARE

FEET, PLUS OR MINUS. >> OKAY. AND IT WAS OUR STAFF THAT DID IT. IT WAS THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE STUFF THAT DID IT.

SO THEY PRESENTED THE 5000 SQUARE FEET IN THE HISTORICAL BOARD SAID, OKAY. HE SAID OKAY. HAD THE CITY NOT APPEALED , HAD THE CITY NOT APPEALED, THIS WOULD HAVE BEEN A DONE DEAL, JUST LIKE THE STAGE. BUT NOW IT IS AN APPEAL AND YOU GUYS ARE ASKING, YOU GUYS ARE ASKING US TO VOTE, THEY ARE ASKING US TO VOTE NOW. WE ARE ASKING OURSELVES TO VOTE.

>> GOT IT. >> OKAY.

>> YOU CLARIFIED IT. THANK YOU.

>> OKAY. SO IS ANYBODY PREPARED TO MAKE A MOTION? LET'S MAKE A

DECISION. >> THE ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION IS NO. THERE ARE DON'T KNOW ADDITIONAL TIMES WERE SPEAKING.

>> JUST CHECKING MY NOTES. >> I DO HAVE A QUESTION FOR THE CITY ATTORNEY. OPTION THREE. MARCH 25TH, 2024. -- IS DENIED.

[03:05:05]

BY THE EVIDENCE PRESENTED, IT'S APPROVAL WILL, THAT IS WHEN YOU ARE LOOKING FOR FURTHER DEFINITION?

>> META-MAYOR AND COMMISSIONERS. YES, SIR. I BELIEVE WHAT THE INTENT WAS IS FOR THE REASONING FOR THE REVERSAL OF THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD TO BE GIVEN, WHATEVER THAT CIRCUMSTANTIAL EVIDENCE IS, THAT THE MOTION IS

BEING MADE BASED ON. >> IS ANYONE PREPARED TO MAKE A

MOTION QUITE >> YOUR DISCUSSION POINTS, I THINK, WERE WHAT NEEDED TO BE INCORPORATED. IF YOU ARE TO MAKE A MOTION FOR DENIAL WHILE OVERTURNING THE DECISION OF THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION, THE SALIENT POINTS YOU BROUGHT UP IN YOUR ARGUMENT, I THINK, THE WAY YOU STATED IT, YOU WOULD NEED TO FINISH THAT SENTENCE. WOULD YOU BE WILLING TO MAKE A

MOTION? >> I WILL HAVE TO GET MY OTHER DEVICE, UNFORTUNATELY. I HAD IT QUEUED UP ON MY IPAD. SORRY.

I DO NOT HAVE IT YET. BUT SOME DISCUSSION POINTS, OBVIOUSLY, CONSIDERING THE PARAMETERS OF THE SPECIFIC DISTRICT, RIGHT? THE EDGARTOWN OVERLAY DISTRICT TO. IN THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD MAKING A RECOMMENDATION. IT IS COMING.

THIS THING IS, WE WILL SHARE THE LOVE WITH SOMEONE ELSE HERE

IN A BIT. >> WOULD IT BE UNDER CONFERENCES? SO THIS THING IS ALMOST REBOOTING. I WILL JUST WAIT. THESE TWO DEVICES ARE MAKING ME CRAZY. I WOULD JUST ASK THE COMMISSION, IF I WERE TO MAKE A MOTION, IS THERE ANY OTHER AMENDMENT TO WHAT IS ON THE SCREEN? IS THERE ANY OTHER RECOMMENDATION FOR A CHANGE? WILL WE INPUT SOME INFORMATION INTO THE BLANK LINES HERE? OR IT DEPENDS ON THE MOTION,

OBVIOUSLY? >> IF YOU ARE MAKING A MOTION TO DENY, IT IS NOT IN CONTINUITY WITH THE ZONING REQUIREMENT. AND THAT IT IS NOT, IT IS SIMPLY NOT COMPLIANT WITH THE PRIMARY USE OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD.

>> THERE ARE OTHER THINGS YOU ARTICULATED. I KNOW

[03:10:02]

COMMISSIONER GAINES IS STRUGGLING WITH THIS TO BE

PASSED, AND I AM TOO. >> YOU ARE NOT THE ONLY ONE.

>> THE CITY IS SMACKED TAB IN THE MIDDLE OF THIS PROBLEM. AND I HAVE OTHER COMMENTARY. BUT I WILL WITHHOLD THAT FOR NOW.

>> THAT LAST COMMENT TOOK ME OVER THE EDGE OF STAFF OUT MEASURING. I WILL HAVE TO LOSE IT THAT WAY. HAVE TO HAVE SOME REAL CONVERSATION OUT OF THIS WEDNESDAY. WELL, THE WAY IT IS PORTRAYED, YOU KNOW , WHAT I HEARD, AND I COULD BE CORRECTED, BUT I HEARD IN HERE THAT STAFF MEASURED OFF THIS PUBIC AREA OUT HERE. I DO NOT KNOW WHO OWES HER THAT. I HAVE A CHALLENGE WITH THAT, WHETHER IT IS 5000 SQUARE FEET OR WHAT IT IS. IF IT IS AN APPEAL, I THINK THAT THE SCOPE OF WORK SHOULD HAVE BEEN DONE BY, WELL, WE APPEALED, SO I GUESS WE DID THE WORK. THAT IS WITH THE FIRST PART OF IT IS. WE ARE GOOD ON THAT. AND THEN, YOU KNOW, STAFF TOOK THAT TO THE HISTORICAL PRESERVATION BOARD. AND THEN THEY BASICALLY APPROVED, THEY SAID, OKAY, 5000 SQUARE FEET FROM THIS BOARD.

OUR HISTORICAL PRESERVATION, WHAT WAS RECOMMENDED. AND --

>> I THINK WHAT TRIGGERED THAT WAS CONVERSATION AND/OR THE HEARING AT THE SPECIAL MAGISTRATE.

>> YEAH. DID WE RECALL THAT ACCURATELY? I THINK WE HAD THAT

IN THE MINUTES. >> I'M NOT SURE ABOUT THAT,

BUT I BELIEVE YOU. >> I, THAT IS EXACTLY HOW IT CAME TO BE HISTORIC PRESERVATION.

>> NO PRESSURE. >> HE IS READY TO MAKE A MOTION? PUT A MOTION ON THE FLOOR.

>> I MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE DECISION OF THE HISTORICAL

PRESENTATION BOARD. >> IS THERE A SECOND?

>> I WILL SECOND IT. >> OKAY. CALL THE ROLL, PLEASE.

>> COMMISSIONER J. JOHNSON? MAYOR HUDSON?

>> AND NOW WE NEED ANOTHER MOTION, I THINK. MOTION FAILED.

>> OUR ISSUE HERE IS THAT , IS THERE A MODIFICATION, GUYS? CAN WE TALK MODIFICATION HERE? I THINK WE HAVE TO TALK MODIFICATION AND HOW CAN WE MODIFY THIS TO BALANCE THIS OUT. YOU KNOW, WE ALLOWED FOR A STAGE TO IN THERE. WHAT WOULD HAVE BEEN HELPFUL IS LOOKING AND CONSIDERING THAT THE STAGE IS THERE AND WHAT WE SAW, I DO NOT KNOW. WHAT I DID HEAR FROM TESTIMONY IS THAT THERE HAVE BEEN NUMEROUS CALLS OR COMPLAINTS, WHATEVER. BUT NONE HAS TRIGGERED AN ACTUAL TICKET OR CITING OF THAT. NONE OF THAT TESTIMONY WAS READ INTO THE RECORD. I DO NOT KNOW WHAT THAT IS AS FAR AS THE NUMBER OF WHAT THAT IS. SO I CAN TELL YOU THAT I DO NOT KNOW WHAT 2500 LOOKS LIKE COMPARED TO THIS, OR EVEN 500. AND I DO NOT WANT TO GET INTO THE WHOLE BACK AND FORTH ABOUT POLICING OR NONE OF THAT RIGHT NOW. BUT WE ARE IN A REAL BAD SITUATION HERE. AND SO WE'VE GOT TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO MAKE THIS RIGHT BY EVERYBODY INVOLVED, INCLUDING THE OWNER AND THE NEIGHBORS. AND I THINK WE HAVE TO FIGURE THIS OUT WITH A MODIFICATION.

[03:15:03]

>> A QUESTION THAT COMES UP, AND I TOUCHED ON THIS EARLIER.

I WOULD BE CURIOUS TO FIND OUT, OR I DO NOT BELIEVE THE INFORMATION IS REALLY TERMINAL. COMMISSIONER GAINES HAS THE PRESERVATION BOARD APPROVING THE 300 SQUARE FOOT SOUND STAGE. WHAT WAS THE CONDITION OF THE SITE WHEN THAT WAS NOT APPROVED? WASN'T ONLY THE 800 SQUARE FOOT OF DUCT AREA THAT WAS THE ORIGINAL OUTSIDE AREA VENUE WHEN SAILFISH WAS ORIGINALLY A TENANT THERE? OR WAS THIS WHOLE OPEN SPACE THERE THEN? OR WAS THAT PUT IN AFTER THE FACT TO ACCOMMODATE FOR THE FOLKS THAT WANTED TO LISTEN TO THE MUSIC FROM THE SOUNDSTAGE.

THE REASON I ASK THAT, A COME BACK TO THE OPTIC -- TOPIC OF SCOPE CREEK. IF THE CITY APPROVED THE SPACE OF A STAGE ABOVE WHAT WAS ORIGINALLY APPROVED AND ADHERED TO, I GET IT. WE CREATED A PROBLEM. THE SUBSEQUENT TO THAT WAS THE ADDITIONAL AREA THEN INCORPORATED TO THE ENTERTAINMENT AREA OR THE SEATING AREA FOR THE SOUNDSTAGE THAT WAS APPROVED. I CAN TELL YOU FOR EFFECTS, AS LONG AS I WAS ON THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD, NOBODY CAME IN LOOKING TO INCREASE THE SQUARE FOOTAGE AREA OF ENTERTAINMENT AREAS FROM 800 SQUARE FEET TO HOWEVER MANY THOUSANDS OF SQUARE FEET IT IS NOW. THAT WAS NEVER ASKED FOR WHEN I SAT ON THAT BOARD. AND THAT GOES BACK PRIOR TO THE APPROVAL OF THE SOUNDSTAGE BY SEVERAL YEARS. YOU UNDERSTAND MY DIFFICULTY WITH THAT ISSUE? WHAT OCCURRED FIRST? WAS A SOUNDSTAGE PUT IN FIRST AND THEN EXPANSION THAT AROUND IT? I THINK MAYOR GAINES IS INDICATING IT IS A RELEVANT POINT. THE PROGRESSION OF THIS IS OF GREAT CONCERN TO ME AS TO HOW THE SPACE WAS CREATED BUT NEVER APPROVED.

>> COMMISSIONER, I HEAR YOU. LET'S JUST STEP BACK AND USE

SOME COMMON SENSE HERE. >> IT WAS 800 FEET. SAY A HYPOTHETICAL, 800 FEET ABOVE SQUARE FOOT USE. SAY I WANTED TO GO TO PIERCE FIGHTER. AND I DO NOT WANT TO BE A PART IF YOGA IS GOING ON IN THE 800 FEET, IF PAINTING ISN'T GOING ON IN THE 800 FEET, BUT I AM THE KID THAT SEES THIS PRETTY MANGO HANGING ON A TREE AND THAT TREE IS NOT WITHIN 800 FEET AND I WALKED OUT OF THAT 800 FEET, AS THE OWNER, CAN I GET THIS MANGO? CAN I HAVE THIS MANGO? HE SAYS YES. NOW HE IS NOT IN COMPLIANCE. BECAUSE I HAVE WALKED OUT OF THE 800 FEET. I'M NOT MAKING NOISE, I AM LAUGHING TO MYSELF, I'M HAPPY I AM ABLE TO PICK THIS MANGO. BUT HE IS OUT OF COMPLIANCE BECAUSE I SIMPLY WALKED OUT OF THIS 800 FEET TO PULL A MANGO IN THE TREE WAS NOT IN THE 800 FEET. IF WE ARE TALKING ABOUT THE STAGE, 800 FEET IS PROBABLY SMALLER THAN THIS. IF WE HAVE SOMEBODY PLAYING ONE SHEET OF MUSIC OR WHATEVER, DO WE REALLY WANT TO PUT THE WHOLE PUBLIC IN RIGHT HERE? DOESN'T THAT CREATE A HAZARD FOR US? I MEAN, I UNDERSTAND HOW WE ARE VOTING TONIGHT. YOU GUYS UNDERSTAND HOW I FEEL. IF I COULD TELL YOU, COMMISSIONER JOHNSON, TO MAKE THE MODIFICATION, BUT I THINK THAT IS JUST A BAND-AID.

I WILL BE HONEST WITH YOU, IF YOU DO THE DENIAL, I WILL BE ON -- TO THAT. I DO NOT CARE ABOUT BEING HERE ALL NIGHT. EVERYBODY IN THE AUDIENCE LISTENING TO THIS LET'S MAKE A MOTION CUT GET A VOTE, AND DEAL WITH IT HOWEVER WE WILL DO WITH IT.

>> THINK YOU FOR DOING THAT, COMMISSIONER GAINES.

[03:20:05]

>> COMMISSIONER J. JOHNSON, DO YOU FEEL COMFORTABLE MAKING A MOTION WITH THE INFORMATION YOU HAVE? OR DO YOU WANT SOMEONE

ELSE TO MAKE A MOTION? >> I MEAN, I CAN MAKE A MOTION AT ANY TIME, I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE IT IS STRUCTURED CORRECTLY. THAT IS MY CHALLENGES. I HAVE MADE ENOUGH COMMENTS HERE. IT IS ON THE RECORD. IT IS REAL AND IT IS ON THE RECORD. THAT WAS AFTER HEARING THE TESTIMONY OF THE APPLICANT AND THE APPELLANT. AND HERE I AM MAKING A DECISION ON THE FACT THAT I HEARD AFTER SUBSTANTIAL QUESTION. I WILL MAKE IT AS SIMPLE AS POSSIBLE. I MAKE A MOTION THAT WE REVERSE THE DECISION OF THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION BOARD AND THE APPLICATION FOR CONDITIONAL USE IS DENIED BASED UPON EVIDENCE PRESENTED AND ITS APPROVAL WILL NEGATIVELY AFFECT THE HEALTH, SAFETY, AND WELFARE OF THE GENERAL PUBLIC.

>> IS THERE A SECOND? >> I SECOND.

>> CALL THE ROLL, PLEASE. >>

[a. Resolution 24-R30 approving the execution of the Termination and Release of an easement held by the City of Fort Pierce for the use and benefit of the Fort Pierce Utilities Authority (FPUA) which is no longer needed by FPUA.]

>> WITH THAT , WE PROPOSE THE NEXT RESOLUTION. IT IS RESOLUTION 24-34 OF THE CITY COMMISSION OF THE FORT PIERCE, FLORIDA AND THE FLORIDA MUNICIPAL CORPORATION APPROVING THE -- FORCED EASEMENT HELD BY THE CITY FOR THE USE AND BENEFIT OF FORT PIERCE AUTHORITY UTILITIES FOR AND UTILITY CLAUSE AND PROVIDING FOR AN EFFECTIVE DATE.

>> THIS IS ATTORNEY HEDGES. >> SORRY, MADAM MAYOR AND COMMISSIONERS. THIS WAS APPROVED BY THE FORT PIERCE UTILITY AUTHORITY. IT IS THE PORTION OF A EASEMENT FOR THE BENEFIT OF THEM. BECAUSE IT WAS TO THE CITY OF THE PIERCE AUTHORITY, WE HAVE TO SIGNOFF ON THAT. MR. ANDREWS HAS REVIEWED IT. WE ARE SEEKING TO BASICALLY FOLLOW SUIT WITH WHAT

THE FPO A HAS DONE. >> IS THERE A MOTION OR

QUESTIONS TO STAFF? >> I MOVED FOR APPROVAL.

>> I SECOND. >> CALL THE ROLL, PLEASE.

>> THE COMMISSION, BUT THIS SURGERY IS KNOCKING THE CRAP OUT OF ME. I WILL HAVE TO DEPART A LITTLE EARLY TONIGHT.

>> WE UNDERSTAND. YOU CAN CATCH UP WITH US LATER.

[14. COMMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC Any person who wishes to comment on any subject may be heard at this time. Please limit your comments to three (3) minutes or less, as directed by the Mayor, as this section of the Agenda is limited to thirty minutes. The City Commission will not be able to take any official actions under Comments from the Public. Speakers will address the Mayor, Commissioners, and the Public with respect. Inappropriate language will not be tolerated.]

>> I WILL WATCH THE REST OF THE MEETING TOMORROW MORNING. I

APOLOGIZE TO THE COMMISSION. >> NEXT, WE MOVE ON TO COMMENTS

FROM THE PUBLIC. >> ANY MEMBER OF THE PUBLIC WHO WISHES TO ADDRESS THE COMMISSION, YOU HAVE THREE MINUTES. PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS. MS. COX WILL GIVE

YOU A THREE SECOND WARNING. >> GOOD MORNING, EVERYONE. MY NAME IS LISA MOBLEY. GREETINGS. MY ADDRESS IS 54014 WINTERGARDEN PARKWAY. FIRST OF ALL, I WOULD LIKE TO THANK YOU ALL WHO ATTENDED THE COMMUNITY MEETINGS THAT WE DID HAVE IN REFERENCE TO THE SHOOTINGS IN THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE. THANK YOU, THANK YOU. COMMISSIONER GAINES WERE COMING OUT YESTERDAY IN SUPPORT OF THE RALLY, WE ARE TRYING TO DO SOMETHING ABOUT THE KILLING AND VIOLENCE IN OUR COMMUNITY. WE DO HAVE ONE REQUEST. BUT THANK YOU ALL FOR COMING LAST SUNDAY.

BUT WE WERE ALWAYS TAUGHT THAT WHEN YOU HAVE THE PEOPLE'S FEAR , THE FACT THAT YOU LEFT AND DID NOT EVEN ADDRESS THE PEOPLE, IT WAS A LITTLE DEMEANING BECAUSE THE CITY NEEDS SOME TYPE OF HOPE. WE DO NOT WANT YOU TO COME AND LIE TO US. WE DO NOT WANT YOU TO COME AND SAY THAT YOU HAVE A SOLUTION WHEN YOU DO NOT HAVE A SOLUTION. IF YOU HAVE THE EAR OF THE PEOPLE, THOSE ARE YOUR CONSTITUENTS. AT LEAST GIVE THEM SOME SENSE OF HOPE IN THE CITY. BECAUSE WHEN YOU SAY THAT YOU THE CITY IS SAFE FOR FEEL SAFE, IF YOU THINK ABOUT AVENUE D, CRIMINALS HAVE REALLY

[03:25:01]

GOTTEN PUSHED OUT OF AVENUE D T - STATIC ] IT IS ONE OF THE SAFEST PLACES YOU COULD BE IN THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE. THE PARK IS A SAFE AREA IN PIERCE. BUT IF YOU ASK BENJAMIN'S FAMILY IF THEY FEEL SAFE, HE WAS INNOCENT BYSTANDER THAT WAS KILLED. IF YOU ASK THE FAMILY OF DEVON BRADLEY, AN I.T. TECH THAT WORKED FOR THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE, THEY FEEL IT IS NOT SAFE. WE NEED TO COME UP WITH SOME TYPE OF RESOLUTION. AND THIS IS FOR EVERYONE. WE WANT YOU GUYS TO KEEP SHOWING UP. WE ARE NOT TRYING TO DISRESPECT ANYONE. WE WANT TO HEAR FROM YOU GUYS. BUT COMMISSIONER JOHNSON, BECAUSE HE DID GIVE US SOME VALID POINTS AND TALK TO US ABOUT THE COMMUNITY AND WHAT WE NEED TO EXPECT -- COMMUNITY. THE PEOPLE WERE EXPECTING TO HEAR SOMETHING.

THEIR PRESENCE IS WELCOME AND IS STILL WELCOME IN OUR COMMUNITY. WE NEED TO HEAR HOPE FROM OUR LEADER. YOU ARE THE MAYOR. YOU ARE THE PEOPLE'S MAYOR. NOT JUST ON ONE SIDE, ALL THE TIME.

KNOW THAT THE MAYOR CARES. WHEN HE STOOD IN FRONT OF THE REPORTER AND ASKED THE JOURNALIST FOR A SOLUTION, THAT WAS A VALID QUESTION -- HAVE THE PEOPLE'S EAR, HAVE SOMETHING TO SAY.

>> THANK YOU VERY MUCH. WHO IS NEXT? TRANSITIONING ]

>> HERE IN THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE OF THIS MAGNITUDE. THIS IS NOT CHICAGO, MIAMI, OR JACKSONVILLE . THIS IS A BEAUTIFUL CITY THIS IS A CITY I ALWAYS REFERRED TO AS THE MOST BEAUTIFUL CITY IN THE WORLD. WITH THE WATER COME WITH THE CULTURE . AND CITY, 48,000 PEOPLE. WITH THE AMOUNT OF HOMICIDES THAT WERE HAVING -- WE ARE HAVING. WHEN I MENTIONED I WAS FROM FORT PIERCE , SHE SAID ARE YOU AFRAID? CAN YOU IMAGINE? SOMEONE FROM FORT LAUDERDALE SAYING THAT TO ME? I WAS SO EMBARRASSED AND HURT. WHAT I'M HERE TO SAY TONIGHT IS THAT YOU ALL HAVE GOT TO CREATE A POLICY. PUT SOMETHING IN PLACE. THIS MADNESS HAS GOT TO STOP. YOU HAVE GOT TO DO SOMETHING. WE SAT HERE WHEN I WAS HERE, WE PLEAD, THE OFFENSES, THE CRIMES, THERE WERE MAJOR CRIMES, THEY WERE DOWNPLAYED BY THE ADMINISTRATION. THEY WERE MINOR CRIMES. TO MAKE THE CRIME RATE LOOK GOOD. THAT'S LIKE TAKING A PAIN PILL AND BEING EATEN UP BY CANCER. WE ARE AT THE POINT RIGHT NOW WHERE WE NEED SOME RADIATION. WE NEED TO STOP THE BLEEDING. I AM TIRED OF GETTING UP ALL TIMES OF THE NIGHT, 12:00, 1:00 IN THE MORNING, GUNSHOTS, AND MY NEIGHBORHOOD.