[00:00:01] ALL RIGHT, WE'RE READY. I'D LIKE TO CALL THIS MEETING TO ORDER. [1. Call to Order] THIS IS A SPECIAL CITY COMMISSION MEETING. IT IS MONDAY, AUGUST 24TH, 2026. PLEASE STAND FOR THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE. I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AND TO THE REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IT STANDS. ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE, WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL. ROLL, PLEASE. MAYOR HUDSON, PRESENT. COMMISSIONER BRODERICK. PRESENT. COMMISSIONER ZADORSKY MAYOR. COMMISSIONER GAINES. PRESENT. MAYOR COMMISSIONER JOHNSON. PRESENT. FIRST ITEM IS ADDITIONS OR DELETIONS TO THE AGENDA AND APPROVAL OF THE AGENDA. [4. Additions or deletions to agenda and approval of the agenda.] ANY CHANGES TO THE AGENDA? IF NOT, I'LL ENTERTAIN A MOTION. MOTION TO APPROVE. SECOND. THERE'S A MOTION AND A SECOND. CALL. THE ROLL, PLEASE. MR. BRODERICK? YES. COMMISSIONER. ZADORSKY. YES. COMMISSIONER. GAINS. YES, MA'AM. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON. YES, MA'AM. MAYOR HUDSON. YES, MA'AM. ALL RIGHT. FIRST NEXT ITEM IS APPROVAL OF CONTRACT WITH S RENEE NARLOCH AND ASSOCIATES TO CONDUCT A PROFESSIONAL PROFESSIONAL SEARCH FOR THE NEXT CITY ATTORNEY AND AMOUNT NOT TO EXCEED $30,950, INCLUDING EXPENSES. MISS. MISS RELL, DID YOU SKIP COMMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC? [5. COMMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC Any person who wishes to comment on any subject may be heard at this time. Please limit your comments to three (3) minutes or less, as directed by the Mayor, as this section of the Agenda is limited to thirty minutes. The City Commission will not be able to take any official actions under Comments from the Public. Speakers will address the Mayor, Commissioners, and the Public with respect. Inappropriate language will not be tolerated.] YES, MA'AM, I DID. I'M SORRY. LET'S GO BACK TO. THAT'S ALL RIGHT. ALL RIGHTY. IT'S NOW AN OPPORTUNITY FOR ANY MEMBER OF THE PUBLIC TO ADDRESS THE COMMISSION. YOU HAVE THREE MINUTES. PLEASE STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS, AND MISS RELL WILL GIVE YOU A TEN SECOND WARNING. THANK YOU. I GIVE THIS TO THE CLERK FOR INCLUSION IN THE RECORD. YEP, YEP. YOU MAY. THANK YOU SIR. KEVIN KEANE 5255 PALMETTO AVENUE IN FORT PIERCE. I OPPOSE AUTHORIZING AS MUCH AS THE 30,950 IN PUBLIC FUNDS FOR AN OUTSIDE FIRM TO SEARCH FOR THE NEXT FORT PIERCE CITY ATTORNEY. THIS IS NOT MERELY A ROUTINE PROFESSIONAL SERVICES EXPENSE. IT'S A SUBSTANTIAL COST NOW BEING PRESENTED AFTER THE CITY HAD ADVANCE NOTICE THAT THE OFFICE WOULD BECOME VACANT AND NEVERTHELESS FAIL TO EXECUTE AN ORDERLY SUCCESSION PROCESS. THE CITY MUST ALSO EXPLAIN WHY AN EXECUTIVE SEARCH CONTRACT IS NECESSARY BEFORE DEMONSTRATING THAT ORDINARY, LESS COSTLY RECRUITMENT METHODS ARE EXHAUSTED. THE CITY HAS A HUMAN RESOURCE DEPARTMENT, ESTABLISHED PROFESSIONAL CONTACTS, ACCESS TO THE FLORIDA BAR, THE FLORIDA MUNICIPAL ATTORNEYS ASSOCIATION, THE FLORIDA LEAGUE OF CITIES, PUBLIC SECTOR EMPLOYMENT NETWORKS AND REGIONAL GOVERNMENTAL RELATIONSHIPS. THE AGENDA MATERIALS COULD IDENTIFY WHICH OF THOSE AVENUES WERE USED WHEN THEY WERE USED, HOW MANY CANDIDATES WERE CONTACTED AND WHY THOSE EFFORTS WERE INADEQUATE. TAXPAYERS SHOULD NOT BE CHARGED NEARLY $31,000 SIMPLY BECAUSE TIMELY INTERNAL ACTION DID NOT OCCUR. FORT PIERCE TAXPAYERS ALREADY FUND A HUMAN RESOURCES DEPARTMENT WHOSE CORE FUNCTIONS INCLUDE ADVERTISING VACANCIES, RECRUITING APPLICANTS, SCREENING QUALIFICATIONS, COORDINATING INTERVIEWS, CHECKING REFERENCES, NEGOTIATING EMPLOYMENT TERMS, AND SUPPORTING THE COMMISSION'S HIRING PROCESS. THE CITY SHOULD EXPLAIN WHICH OF THOSE ORDINARY FUNCTIONS TO OWN PERSONAL AREA TO THEIR OWN PERSONAL AREA ARE UNABLE TO PERFORM. IN THIS CASE, HUMAN RESOURCES CAN PUBLISH THE VACANCY THROUGH PROFESSIONAL ASSOCIATIONS, MUNICIPAL NETWORKS, GOVERNMENT EMPLOYMENT PLATFORMS, THE FLORIDA BAR, AND DIRECT OUTREACH TO QUALIFIED PUBLIC SECTOR ATTORNEYS BEFORE ANOTHER 31000 IS COMMITTED. THE PUBLIC DESERVES AN ITEMIZED EXPLANATION TO WHICH TASKS CANNOT BE PERFORMED BY THE EMPLOYEES AND RESOURCES THE TAXPAYERS ALREADY FUND. THE COMMISSION SHOULD NOT CONVERT A PREDICTABLE VACANCY INTO AN EXPENSIVE EMERGENCY APPROVING THE CONTRACT WITHOUT FIRST EXAMINING THE DELAY WOULD REWARD POOR PLANNING, CONCEAL ACCOUNTABILITY AND ESTABLISH THE WRONG PRECEDENT THAT WHEN CITY LEADERSHIP FAILS TO PREPARE FOR A KNOWN DEPARTURE, THE PUBLIC WILL SIMPLY BE BILLED FOR AN OUTSIDE FIRM TO REPAIR THE CONSEQUENCES. THANK YOU. THANK YOU SIR. ANYONE ELSE WISHING TO ANYONE ELSE? SEEING NO MOVEMENT, WE'LL MOVE ON. OKAY. SO NOW THE NEXT ITEM IS APPROVAL OF THE CONTRACT WITH S RENEE NARLOCH AND ASSOCIATES TO CONDUCT THE PROFESSIONAL SEARCH FOR THE NEXT CITY [A. Approval of contract with S. Renée Narloch & Associates to conduct the professional search for the next City Attorney in an amount not to exceed $30,950.00, including expenses.] ATTORNEY IN AN AMOUNT NOT TO EXCEED 30,950, INCLUDING EXPENSES. MR.. CHESS? YES. MR. SORENSEN HAS THE CONTRACT. I BELIEVE IT WAS ATTACHED TO THE AGENDA FOR MISS NARLOCH ALREADY. MR. SORENSEN, JARED SORENSEN, HR MANAGER. FOR YOUR MADAM MAYOR, ATTACHED TO THE AGENDA ITEM WAS THE CONTRACT WITH RENEE NARLOCH AND ASSOCIATES, AND SHE HAS SIGNED THE AGREEMENT. AND WE'RE HERE TO AT THE PLEASURE OF THE CITY COMMISSION. THIS IS SOMETHING YOU ASKED TO HAVE TO ENGAGE AN OUTSIDE FIRM TO DO THE SEARCH. [00:05:02] AND SO WE'RE HERE FOR ASKING FOR APPROVAL, AND I'M HERE TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MAY HAVE. YOU PASS SOMETHING OUT FOR US. IS THAT A PROPOSED TIMELINE? SO YES, SHE HAS SENT ME A TENTATIVE PROPOSED TIMELINE FOR YOU TO START LOOKING AT. IF SOMETHING ON THERE SEEMS LIKE IT'S GOING TO BE A CONFLICT OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT, YOU CAN GIVE ME DIRECTION IN WHICH YOU WANT ME TO GO, AND I CAN GO BACK AND GET WITH HER AND REVISE THE TIMELINE. QUESTIONS OF MR. SORENSEN. QUESTIONS? ONE SECOND, MADAM MAYOR. MR. JOHNSON, THANK YOU. THANK YOU, MADAM MAYOR. MR. SORENSEN, THANK YOU FOR AND THANK YOU FOR PROVIDING THIS TIMELINE. THIS IS UNFORTUNATELY NOT THE FIRST TIME WE'VE HAD A SEARCH FOR A CITY ATTORNEY. I KNOW WE'VE USED THIS FIRM ALSO WHEN WE'VE LOOKED WITH CITY MANAGER SEARCH AS OUR POLICE CHIEF. POLICE CHIEF. I'M SORRY, POLICE CHIEF. I KNOW IT WAS SOMETHING RECENT. OKAY. SO SO YOUR YOUR PROFESSIONAL OPINION HERE AS FAR AS THE EXPEDIENCY LOOKING AT THIS TIMELINE LOOKS PRETTY AGGRESSIVE. TO ME. ANY FEEDBACK THAT YOU WOULD HAVE BASED ON THIS OR COMMENTS YOU'VE HAD WITH HER ABOUT HER? INDICATION AS TO THE, THE MEETING OF THIS AGGRESSIVENESS OF THIS TIMELINE OR ANYTHING THAT'S WRITTEN HERE THAT YOU CAN THINGS THAT I WOULD COMMENT. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON IS ONE, I THINK EACH ONE OF THESE ITEMS SHOULD BE PUSHED BACK A WEEK JUST BECAUSE WE'RE GETTING INTO THIS JUST NOW. AND IT'S PRETTY AGGRESSIVE FOR THIS. I THINK WE SHOULD PUSH THEM BACK A WEEK. OKAY. SHE FEELS PRETTY CONFIDENT THAT SHE'S DOING SEVERAL CITY ATTORNEY RECRUITMENTS THROUGHOUT THE STATE, SO SHE HAS A GOOD GRASP, A GOOD PIPELINE, IF YOU WILL, OF CANDIDATES ALREADY IN THERE. SO SHE FEELS EVEN THOUGH IT SEEMS AGGRESSIVE, SHE FEELS PRETTY CONFIDENT THAT SHE CAN MEET THESE THESE DEADLINES. OKAY. IN ADDITION TO THAT I ENJOYED OUR RELATIONSHIP WHEN WE WORKED TOGETHER FOR THE POLICE CHIEF. I THOUGHT SHE DID A FANTASTIC JOB OF GETTING US SOME GOOD QUALITY APPLICANTS. WE WORKED TOGETHER, PUTTING TOGETHER A MEET AND GREET FOR THE POLICE CHIEF, IF YOU REMEMBER, AND WE THOUGHT THAT WENT OVER PRETTY WELL. ALLOWED THE PUBLIC TO HAVE INPUT INTO WHAT THEY WERE LOOKING FOR. HAD THE POLICE DEPARTMENT LOOK INTO WHAT THEY WERE LOOKING FOR. SO I THINK SHE WOULD DO A FINE JOB OF THIS AS WELL. OKAY. YEAH, I AGREE WITH THAT. I THINK THE, THE TENURE OF THIS IS A LITTLE DIFFERENT. THIS IS ONE OF OUR, ONE OF OUR THREE CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS WHICH ACTUALLY REPORT TO THE CITY COMMISSION. SO I THINK THAT IT'S VERY IMPORTANT, OBVIOUSLY, THAT THE COMMISSIONERS HAVE THAT TIME TO INTERACT. AND CERTAINLY LOOKING AT THE DIRECTION IN WHICH WE WERE LOOKING FOR IN A, IN A CITY ATTORNEY. SO I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT, THAT THE COMMITMENT WAS THERE. THANK YOU FOR THE CONTEXT THAT YOU'VE PROVIDED FOR THIS. SO I'M VERY COMFORTABLE, MADAM MAYOR AND FELLOW COMMISSIONERS, WITH WHAT I'M SEEING HERE. LOOKS LIKE WE'RE GOING TO BE BUSY LIKE WE ALWAYS ARE IN THE FALL. SO THANK YOU. WHEN YOU SAY PUSHBACK, DO YOU MEAN EVERYTHING IS GOING TO BE A WEEK LATER? IS THAT WHAT YOU MEAN? THAT'S WHAT I WAS RECOMMENDING, IS THAT WE TAKE A LOOK AT IT AND THEN JUST BASICALLY MOVE IT BACK A WEEK. EVERYTHING JUST MOVED BACK A WEEK. OKAY. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? ANY OTHER COMMENTS? MADAM MAYOR. YES, SIR. COMMISSIONERS. YEAH. I RESPECT THE IDEA OF MOVING IT BACK A WEEK, BUT I THINK THAT SHE'S ALREADY PROBABLY ALREADY WORKING ON THIS ONE WAY OR THE OTHER. WHILE THE EXPECTATION OF A FINAL MAY BE PUSHED BACK A WEEK. BUT I THINK THE PROCESS SHOULD STILL BE GOING ON NOW. SO I REALLY, I DON'T KNOW IF THE COMMISSIONERS BELIEVE THAT TO BE TRUE. BUT I THINK THE PROCESS NEEDS TO BEGIN. AND AGAIN, SHE'S HAD NOTICE FOR A WHILE THAT THIS WAS ONGOING. THE EXPECTATION OF HER BEING APPROVED, I THINK WAS PRETTY HIGH. SO MY HOPE IS THAT SHE'S STILL WORKING ON THIS AND MOVING FORWARD AND THE EXPECTATION OF MAYBE GETTING A FINAL RESULT, MAYBE PUSHED BACK A WEEK. BUT I CAN TELL YOU SHE'S STILL WORKING ON THIS, AND I HAVE NO DOUBT THAT SHE CAN STILL MEET THESE DEADLINES AS FAR AS STARTING THIS WEEK. IF YOU LOOK AT IT, THE PROPOSED AGENDA THAT IT WOULD BE THURSDAY THAT SHE WOULD REACH OUT AND START TALKING TO COMMISSIONERS AND KIND OF GET WHAT IT IS THAT YOU'RE LOOKING FOR KIND OF SETTING THE STAGE AND SUCH LIKE THAT, AS WELL AS TALKING TO, YOU KNOW, OTHER INDIVIDUALS. BUT I THINK SHE CAN STILL MEET THAT IF THAT'S THE DESIRE OF THE COMMISSION. I DO HAVE A FOLLOW UP QUESTION. SO SHE'S NOT ENGAGED AS OF TODAY. CORRECT. SHE'S NOT ENGAGED BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE THE CONTRACT SIGNED, BUT SHE HAS BEEN WORKING ON THE TIMELINE AND SUCH LIKE THAT. YES, SIR. ARE YOU AWARE WHAT DIRECTION SHE'S BEEN TAKING FROM OTHER CITY COMMISSIONERS? I AM NOT. ARE YOU AWARE OF DISCUSSIONS THAT HAVE BEEN TAKING PLACE BETWEEN HER AND OTHER CITY COMMISSIONERS? NO, SIR. I'M NOT. THANK YOU. I WANT TO CALL YOUR ATTENTION TO THE JUNE 4TH MEMO FROM OUR CITY ATTORNEY, HEDGES. ABOUT WHAT THIS A YEAR A KIND OF A WHAT THIS OFFICER HAD DONE IN THE PREVIOUS YEAR. I THINK THAT WOULD BE IMPORTANT FOR MISS NARLOCH TO SEE. OKAY. IT'S I'LL JUST HIGHLIGHT IT. EVERYBODY'S HAD THIS BECAUSE IT WAS ON THE JUNE FOR THE JUNE AGENDA, [00:10:01] 473 REQUESTS FOR LEGAL SERVICES. AND THE THREE LAWSUITS DEFENDED IN, IN COURT AND SUCCESSFULLY 20 RISK PROTECTION ORDERS 25 CODE AND SPECIAL MAGISTRATE MEETINGS AND 500 AND DEALT WITH 500 RESEARCHED AND DEALT WITH 590 VIOLATIONS AND ALSO AN ANIMAL CONTROL LAWSUIT DEFENDED 11 MAGISTRATE HEARINGS FOR THE BUSINESS FOR THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT WITH COVERING 78 VIOLATIONS 20 STAFFING. 20 BOARD AND COMMITTEE MEETINGS. DEALING TRAINING STAFF WITH SUNSHINE AND PUBLIC RECORDS AND CONFLICT OF INTEREST AND ARBITRATION AND CIVIL SERVICE APPEALS. ALL OF THOSE ARE WHAT AS WELL AS RUNNING THE RISK MANAGEMENT DEPARTMENT AS OF RIGHT NOW. SO ALL OF THOSE THINGS ARE WHAT ARE INVOLVED IN OUR CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE. AND THOSE THINGS WHICH WILL LEAD INTO THE NEXT DISCUSSION ARE WE'RE DONE WITH THREE ATTORNEYS AND A PARALEGAL. AND SO NOW THAT OFFICE HAS ZERO ATTORNEYS AND A PARALEGAL. SO I, I THINK THAT IF MISS NARLOCH HAS THE. THIS JUNE, JUNE 4TH, 2026 MEMO, IT GIVES A GOOD OVERVIEW OF WHAT THAT OFFICE HAS TO DEAL WITH FOR, FOR HER AND FOR POTENTIAL CANDIDATES. OKAY. I CAN CERTAINLY DOWNLOAD THAT FROM THE AGENDA. YES. AND SEND IT TO HER. YEAH. I THINK THAT WOULD BE IMPORTANT. OKAY. IS COMMISSIONER. I HAVE TO SAY SOMETHING. LAST MEETING, I ASKED THAT WE STOP DOING THIS, BUT, I MEAN, TO THROW OUT ALLEGATIONS OR ASK THE QUESTIONS THAT COMMISSIONERS HAVE HAVE TALKED TO MISS NORLOCK. I DON'T KNOW WHERE THAT'S COMING FROM. I HAVE NOT TALKED TO HER. SO, COMMISSIONER, IF YOU KNOW SOMEBODY THAT HAS THAT HAS TALKED TO MISS NORLOCK DON'T OPEN UP WITH A A BLANKET STATEMENT. ASK THE QUESTION. IF YOU KNOW SOMETHING, LET US KNOW BECAUSE I HAVE NOT TALKED TO MISS NORLOCK, SO I DON'T KNOW WHERE THAT CAME FROM. I DON'T KNOW IF ANY OTHER COMMISSIONERS OR THE MAYOR HAS TALKED TO MISS NORLOCK, BUT FROM DAY ONE, FROM DAY ONE, WE HAVE GIVEN THIS TO HR AND WE'VE GIVEN THIS TO HR TO DO THIS, TO DO WHAT HE'S SUPPOSED TO DO. NOW, IF WE WANT TO ASK QUESTIONS, WHY ARE WE GOING TO ASK QUESTIONS WHERE OTHER STAFF HAVE TALKED TO MISS NORLOCK OR OR CANDIDATES? SO LET'S NOT COME THIS MORNING AND THROW OUT JUST THESE VAGUE QUESTIONS LIKE PUT IT IN LIKE ONE OF US IS SECRETLY TALKING TO MISS NORLOCK OR DOING SOMETHING MISS NORLOCK, BECAUSE FROM MY SEAT I HAVE NOT. SO IF COMMISSIONER IS UP HERE IS IS DOING SOMETHING AND TALKING TO MISS. NO LUCK. I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW. SO I'M JUST SAYING THAT RIGHT NOW BECAUSE I HAVE NOT. OKAY, WELL LET'S GET MORE SPECIFIC THEN. I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WHAT DECISIONS WERE REACHED BETWEEN CITY MANAGEMENT AND SPECIFIC CITY COMMISSIONERS IN PRIVATE MEETINGS THAT WERE HELD LAST WEEK. ONCE MR. MCINTYRE DID NOT ACCEPT THE POSITION, FOR OBVIOUS REASONS THAT THE ENTIRE LEGAL DEPARTMENT IS GONE. I HAVE BEEN ADVISED BY MULTIPLE PEOPLE THAT THERE WERE LENGTHY AND MULTIPLE MEETINGS TAKING PLACE IN CITY HALL BETWEEN CITY MANAGEMENT AND SPECIFIC CITY COMMISSIONERS, AND I'M SURE THAT DECISIONS WERE REACHED AT THOSE MEETINGS. I'D LIKE TO KNOW WHAT THOSE DECISIONS ARE. WELL, I CAN SPEAK FOR MYSELF. COMMISSIONER BRODERICK. AND I'M NOT SURE WHAT MEETINGS YOU'RE YOU'RE SPEAKING OF, BUT THERE WAS NOT ANY SPECIAL MEETINGS CONDUCTED WITH ME ON THE CITY COMMISSIONERS OR THE MAYOR. WE HAD A TYPICAL ONE ON ONES, WHICH I HAD A ONE ON ONE WITH YOU, AND I CALLED YOU ON FRIDAY TO LET YOU KNOW THAT MR. MCINTYRE DID NOT ACCEPT THE POSITION. I COULDN'T I COULDN'T REACH YOU. I RETURNED YOUR CALL ON FRIDAY, BUT I WAS ADVISED FROM THE CITY ATTORNEY AS TO WHAT THE STATUS WAS. WELL, I DIDN'T RECEIVE THE CALL. I DIDN'T GET A MISSED CALL, BUT THAT HE WAS THERE. BUT TO YOUR QUESTION, THERE WAS NO DISCUSSION WHATSOEVER IN DETAIL WITH ANY OF THE COMMISSIONERS ABOUT OTHER THAN THE FACT THAT I INFORMED THEM THAT MR. MCINTYRE DECIDED NOT TO TAKE THE POSITION. NOW, IF YOU WANT TO GO INTO DETAIL WHY HE DIDN'T DO THAT, I'LL LET MR. SAMPSON SPEAK TO THAT. I WANT TO BE CLEAR. AS FAR AS MRS ARE CONCERNED, EVEN I MAINTAIN MY INDEPENDENCE. I HAVEN'T SPOKEN TO HER SINCE THE CHIEF'S RECRUITMENT. WHEN I GAVE MY FUNCTIONS AND TASKS TO MY STAFF. I EXPECT THEM TO BE PROFESSIONAL, MAINTAIN THEIR INDEPENDENCE AND CONFIDENTIALITY. AND I'M ALL FOR ONE. ONE FOR ALL OF US. SAY ONE THING TO ANYONE ON THIS DAIS. I SAY IT TO YOU ALL. I ALWAYS SAY THAT. I'VE ALWAYS DONE THAT. SO I DON'T KNOW WHAT'S BEEN SAID TO YOU. YOU CAN ALWAYS ASK ME, YOU KNOW, I'M STRAIGHT WITH YOU ABOUT WHAT'S BEEN SAID, WHAT'S BEEN REGARDING MR. MCINTYRE. I'LL LET MR. SORENSEN GO INTO DETAIL ON WHY HE FELT HE DIDN'T WANT TO TAKE THE POSITION. BUT I WILL TELL YOU THIS, MR. SORENSEN, MYSELF AND AN OUTSIDE ATTORNEY DID CALL MR. [00:15:03] MCINTYRE TO DISCUSS THE SITUATION. BY THE TIME WE HAD GOTTEN TO THEM, HE ALREADY RECEIVED A CALL FROM THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE AND A CONSULTANT OUTSIDE CONSULTANT. AND I'LL LET YOU GO INTO THE DETAIL IF YOU WANT TO KNOW THAT. SO TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION, NO SPECIFIC MEETINGS WITH ME AND COMMISSION. I INFORMED MR. MCINTYRE'S DECISION. I COULD TRY TO INFORM YOU ON FRIDAY AND THAT WAS IT. WELL, I THINK THIS WILL BE BORNE OUT FAIRLY RAPIDLY, BECAUSE I'M SURE THAT THE DECISION HAS ALREADY BEEN MADE AS TO WHO'S GOING TO BE PROPOSED TO BE HIRED. A MOTION WILL BE MADE AND SECONDED AND APPROVED. SO WE'LL SEE THIS INFORMATION SHORTLY. IT'LL BE BORNE OUT IN THE NEXT SEVERAL MINUTES. BUT THANK YOU FOR THE INFORMATION, MADAM MAYOR, WOULD THAT COMMENT AS WELL? I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT. I WANT TO BE CLEAR. WHEN I SPOKE TO EACH OF MY BOSSES, INCLUDING YOU, WHICH I DIDN'T CONTACT, I WAS DISCUSSING OPTIONS AND THE MAYOR SPECIFICALLY SAID, WE NEED TO CALL A SPECIAL MEETING. WE CAN'T WAIT TO SEPTEMBER 8TH TO DISCUSS THIS. I SAID, WELL, MADAM MAYOR, WE HAVE A COUPLE OF OPTIONS HERE. WE HAVE AN INTERNAL CANDIDATE THAT WE PROBABLY COULD CONSIDER, MY DEPUTY CITY MANAGER, WHO IS AN ATTORNEY WHO WORKED IN THAT OFFICE, OR WE CAN GO WITH AN OUTSIDE CONSULTANT AND THEN FEES ARE EXORBITANT. SO AT THAT POINT, THAT'S DISCUSSION THAT'S GOING TO BE HAD TO GET AHEAD OF THIS IN THE NEXT ITEM ON THE AGENDA. NOW, WHETHER IT'S DECIDED OR NOT, I'M NOT SIGNING ANYTHING. IT'S NOT MY DECISION. IT HAS BEEN DECIDED IF ANYONE ON HERE WE TALKED ABOUT OPTIONS. AND AS I SAID, I WANTED TO SHARE THAT SAME DISCUSSION WITH YOU. I DID NOT HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO. I'M GOING TO RESPOND TO COMMISSIONER GAINES'S COMMENTS EARLIER THAT OVER THE LAST SEVERAL MEETINGS OF THIS COMMISSION, I HAVE BEEN TOLD WHAT INFORMATION I CAN REQUEST FROM CITY HALL, WHAT INFORMATION I CAN'T REQUEST FROM CITY HALL. I'VE BEEN TOLD WHEN I CAN MAKE A MOTION, WHEN I CAN'T MAKE A MOTION, AND I'VE BEEN TOLD IN WHAT INFORMATION I CAN MAKE THAT MOTION, WHAT INFORMATION I CAN BRING UP AT A MEETING. THAT'S NOT GOING TO WORK WITH ME ANY LONGER. SO I'M JUST PUTTING IT ON THE RECORD RIGHT NOW THAT THAT IS UNACCEPTABLE TO ME. WELL, YOU GUYS ARE NOT MY BOSS. WELL, AND I DIDN'T I DIDN'T SAY CITIZENS OF THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE. I DIDN'T TELL YOU THAT. SO DON'T PUT WORDS IN MY MOUTH. I DIDN'T SAY THAT. I SAID STOP COMING WITH THESE SURPRISE ATTACKS AT CITY HALL. CAN WE GO BACK TO BEING ONE FORT PIERCE LIKE WE WERE? GENTLEMEN, GENTLEMEN, PLEASE ASK THE MAYOR FOR PERMISSION TO SPEAK. ANYBODY ELSE WANT TO SPEAK? YES. FOR THE RECORD, I HAVE NOT SPOKEN, NOR HAVE I EVER MET THE CONSULTANT. AND FOR THE RECORD, I SPOKE WITH MR. CHESS WHENEVER HE CALLED TO TELL ME THE RESULTS, THAT MR. MCINTYRE WAS NOT GOING TO TAKE THE POSITION AND WAS TOLD THAT A COUPLE OTHER FOLKS IN THE ATTORNEY'S OFFICE WERE NOT GOING TO CONTINUE THEIR CONTRACTS. THAT'S THE END OF MY INTERACTION. SAME HERE. MADAM MAYOR. COMMISSIONER. YEAH. I'M GOING TO GO ON THE RECORD BECAUSE I WASN'T EVEN IN CITY HALL LAST WEEK, NUMBER ONE. DID NOT MEET WITH ANYBODY. I CANCELED MY WHOLE OFFICE DAY, SO I WASN'T EVEN UP HERE LAST WEDNESDAY. I RECEIVED A CALL FROM MR. CHESS GIVING ME AN UPDATE. OBVIOUSLY, I'VE RECEIVED EMAILS FROM SOME STAFF WHEN PEOPLE HAVE RESIGNED. RESIGNED? THAT'S COME ACROSS ALL OF OUR EMAILS, I THINK. AND THAT'S IT. AND I HAVEN'T TALKED TO MISS NORLOCK SINCE WE HAD TO SEARCH FOR THE CHIEF. SO THAT'S IT FOR ME ON THE RECORD. ANYTHING ELSE ON THIS TOPIC? ANYTHING ELSE? ALRIGHTY. ARE WE GOING TO. OH, MR. SORENSEN PUBLIC COMMENT WAS TALKED ABOUT THIS BEING SOMETHING THAT COULD BE DONE IN HOUSE AND WE COULD SAVE THE MONEY. AND I'M WONDERING IF MAYBE MR. CHESS OR YOU CAN ADDRESS THE REASONS WHY YOU'RE RECOMMENDING AN OUTSIDE SEARCH. WHICH WHICH OF YOU WOULD LIKE TO DO IT? PROBABLY RECOMMEND AN OUTSIDE SEARCH. YES. CAN YOU REPEAT THE QUESTION AGAIN, PLEASE? WE DID. WE DID SO IN IN THE PUBLIC COMMENT, WE WERE ASKED WHY WE WERE DOING A SEARCH INSTEAD OF USING IN-HOUSE. AND I, I KNOW THAT WE'VE HAD EXPERIENCE WITH BOTH AND I KNOW, I THINK I KNOW THE ANSWER, BUT I WANTED YOU TO BE ABLE TO COMMENT ON THAT. FROM, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE EXPERIENCE HAS BEEN IN THE PAST WITHOUT USING AN OUTSIDE RECRUITMENT FIRM FOR PROFESSIONAL POSITIONS. BUT SINCE I'VE BEEN HERE, I BELIEVE IT WAS A VERY SUCCESSFUL PROFESSIONAL INDEPENDENT. IT LACKS THE INFLUENCE, FOR INSTANCE, OF THE CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE GETTING INVOLVED AND HAVING HIS STAFF DIRECTLY RECRUIT AND ME MAKING THOSE DECISIONS. I FEEL HAVING AN INDEPENDENT RECRUITMENT PROFESSIONAL FIRM WHO'S MANAGING THAT PROCESS. THE EMAILS, THE COMMUNICATION, THE RESUMES, AND FILTERING THAT TO THE HR MANAGER WHO WOULD THEN FILTER IT BACK TO THE CITY COMMISSION. I THINK IT LEADS FOR MORE INDEPENDENCE IN DECISION MAKING, AND ALSO THE TIME INVOLVED IN TERMS OF GOING THROUGH THOSE APPLICATIONS AND FILTERING THROUGH THE RESUMES. I BELIEVE THAT IT'S BEST TO HAVE AN OUTSIDE FIRM DO THAT FROM A COST PERSPECTIVE. I THINK IT'S VERY COST BENEFICIAL TO DO IT FROM AN OUTSIDE CONSULTANT BASIS AS OPPOSED TO HAVE HR AND THEIR STAFF INVOLVED. AND THEN YOU GET INTO THIS ISSUE OF PERSONALITY AS WELL. THEY DON'T LIKE THIS PERSON. THEY WANT TO HIRE THIS PERSON TO MEET SOMEONE TO MEET CERTAIN NEEDS OF STAFF IN THE CITY. SO I [00:20:05] FEEL THE INDEPENDENCE ASPECT IS WHAT I ENCOURAGE MORE FOR GOING OUTSIDE. THANK YOU. MR. SORENSEN, DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING TO ADD? THE ONLY THING THAT I WOULD SAY JUST TO GO ON THE RECORD, IS THAT MY STAFF IS COMPETENT TO DO IT. ABSOLUTELY, 100%. THE INDEPENDENCE IS REALLY WHAT WE WERE LOOKING FOR AND THE TIME, EFFORT AND ENERGY THAT'S PUT IN TO DO THAT. IT'S AN EXHAUSTIVE, IT'S IT'S A, IT'S A VERY LENGTHY, INVOLVED PROCESS, AND THE CONCERN THAT I HAVE IS THAT WOULD THE POSITION BE IN SUCH A HIGH LEVEL POSITION, SUCH A POLITICAL CHARTER OFFICER, THAT WITH AN OUTSIDE FIRM INDEPENDENCY, IT WOULD BE BETTER FOR THE CITY BECAUSE SOMEBODY COULD SAY SOMETHING ABOUT THE HR OFFICE BEING UNDER THE INFLUENCE OF WHOMEVER. AND SO I AGREE WITH THE COMMENTS THAT THE CITY MANAGER SPOKE. ANY OTHER DISCUSSION ON THIS ISSUE? IS THERE A MOTION? MADAM MAYOR, I MOVE APPROVAL OF THIS AGENDA ITEM TO APPROVE THE CONTRACT. MR. NORLOCK SECOND. IS THERE A SECOND? OKAY. CALL THE ROLL, PLEASE. COMMISSIONER BRODERICK. OH. COMMISSIONER SADOWSKI. YES, MA'AM. COMMISSIONER GAINES. YES, MA'AM. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON. YES, MA'AM. MAYOR HUDSON. YES, MA'AM. AND ITEM IS DISCUSSION AND DIRECTION AND OR SELECTION OF AN INTERIM CITY ATTORNEY AND MISS RL. [B. Discussion, direction and/or selection of an Interim City Attorney] THAT THAT INCLUDES THE PUSHBACK OF THE WEEK IN TERMS OF THE TIMELINE. IT DIDN'T HAVE TO BE IN THE MOTION, BUT I JUST MEAN THAT THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE DISCUSSED AND THAT'S WHAT I THINK THAT'S WHAT THE COMMISSION IS ASSUMING YOU'RE GOING TO OPERATE UNDER. OKAY. YES. JUST TO BE CLEAR ALREADY, THIS IS NOW. SO THE THINGS THAT I SAID IN THE LAST AGENDA ITEM WERE I ALSO MEANT FOR THIS ITEM. I JUST WANTED THIS COMMISSION TO BE AWARE OF ALL THE THINGS THAT HAPPENED THAT MAYBE NONE OF US ARE REALLY AWARE OF, OF THE VOLUME OF WORK THAT HAS BEEN DONE BY THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE. AND WHEN FULLY STAFFED, IT THAT'S IT HAS THREE ATTORNEYS AND A PARALEGAL. AND WITH THE DEPARTURE OF MISS HEDGES ON SEPTEMBER 10TH OR SEPTEMBER 11TH THAT THERE WILL BE ONLY A PARALEGAL LEFT IN THE OFFICE. AND SO I THINK THAT FOR THE PROTECTION OF THE CITY, WE CANNOT HAVE A VACANT CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE. AND SO I'M SETTING THE STAGE FOR OUR DISCUSSION TODAY. MR. SORENSEN, SIR? SURE. MR. SORENSEN, ARE YOU GOING TO WEIGH IN ON THIS? OKAY. PROCEED. I THINK MY NAME IS JARED SORENSEN, I'M THE HR MANAGER. THANK YOU. FOR THE RECORD. WHAT I'D LIKE TO DO IS KIND OF JUST REAL QUICKLY GIVE YOU A A FEEDBACK FROM LAST WEEK OF WHAT HAPPENED AND HOW WE GOT TO WHERE WE ARE. IF I MAY. SO I SPOKE WITH MR. MCINTYRE ON THE EVENING OF TUESDAY, AUGUST 18TH, 2026. I DIDN'T GET A CHANCE TO SPEAK WITH HIM THAT MORNING BECAUSE I WAS BUSY TIED UP WITH OTHER THINGS. WHEN I SPOKE WITH HIM, HE MENTIONED TO ME THAT HE HAD SPOKEN WITH CAROLINE AND SARAH AND LEARNED THAT FELICIA WAS LEAVING, AND AS WELL AS CAROLINE'S, DECIDED TO END HER CONTRACT WITH THE CITY AT THE END OF AUGUST. HE ALSO AS MENTIONED THAT THE RISK MANAGER WAS LEAVING ON SEPTEMBER THE 1ST. HE STATED TO ME THAT HE WAS CONCERNED. HE. WHEN HE ORIGINALLY TALKED ABOUT TAKING THE POSITION. WHEN HE WAS REALLY INTERESTED IN TAKING A POSITION, HE FELT LIKE THE STAFF WAS GOING TO BE IN PLACE AND HE WOULD JUST BE COMING IN AND PROVIDING LEADERSHIP. SO HE REALLY HAS SOME CONCERNS ABOUT THE STAFF NOT BEING THERE AND ONLY HAVING A LEGAL ASSISTANT IN THE OFFICE. SO WE TALKED ABOUT SOME OF THE OPTIONS THAT WE COULD DO, AND I SPOKE TO HIM AND I TOLD HIM, I SAID, LET ME TAKE TO THE CITY MANAGER YOUR CONCERNS SO THAT HE CAN, YOU KNOW, MENTION THE COMMISSION OR SEE WHAT WE COULD DO TO TRY TO ADDRESS YOUR CONCERNS. SO I SPOKE WITH THE CITY MANAGER THAT NEXT MORNING AND HE AND I AND THE CITY'S LABOR ATTORNEY REACHED OUT TO MR. MCINTYRE ON WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 19TH. AND WHAT WE EXPLAINED TO HIM IS THAT WE'VE FOUND A COUPLE OF VERY SEASONED GOVERNMENTAL ATTORNEYS THAT WORK WITH ALAN NORTON AND BLUE THAT WORK IN JC'S FIRM, THE LABOR ATTORNEY'S FIRM. THEY'RE BASED OUT OF TALLAHASSEE. THEY'RE ABLE TO COME DOWN, BE ON SITE WHEN NEEDED. THEY'RE ABLE TO BE CALLED WHEN THEY NEED YOU KNOW, QUESTIONS OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT THEY CAN ADVISE ON. AND THEN WE ALSO MENTIONED TO THEM THAT WE'VE IDENTIFIED A, THAT WE WOULD REACH OUT TO ROBERT HALF AND OTHER TEMP AGENCIES AND IDENTIFY A, AN ATTORNEY TO BRING ON SITE LIKE A TEMPORARY ATTORNEY TO BRING ON SITE WHO HAS GOVERNMENTAL EXPERIENCE AS WELL AS A PARALEGAL TO KIND OF SHORE UP HIS HIS STAFF. HE APPRECIATED THAT. HE SAID HE WANTED TO THINK ABOUT IT OVERNIGHT AND HE'D GIVE ME A CALL IN THE MORNING. SO THEN ON THURSDAY MORNING, I SPOKE WITH MR. MCINTYRE AGAIN, AND THAT WAS AUGUST THE 20TH. [00:25:01] AND HE STATED HE APPRECIATED EVERYTHING THAT WE DID TO TRY TO RESOLVE HIS CONCERNS. BUT AT THAT POINT, HE DECIDED NOT. IT WASN'T SOMETHING THAT HE WANTED TO CONTINUE FURTHER. SO HE DECIDED NOT TO TAKE THE POSITION. SO AT THAT POINT, I HAD A FOLLOW UP CONVERSATION WITH THE CITY MANAGER. HE SPOKE WITH THE MY UNDERSTANDING AS HE SPOKE WITH THE COMMISSION AND SAID, LOOK, HERE'S THE OPTIONS. WE TALKED ABOUT GETTING AN OUTSIDE FIRM. I'VE GOT TWO NAMES THAT WERE GIVEN TO ME BY AN OUTSIDE FIRM. ONE IS ON THE, IT'S OVER ON THE WEST COAST IN CLEARWATER, WHICH IS NOT CLOSE TO US. ANOTHER FIRM WAS GIVEN TO ME OF ONE THAT'S DOWN BASED OUT OF FORT LAUDERDALE, BUT THEY HAVE AN OFFICE IN SAINT LUCIE COUNTY AND THEY'VE DONE GOVERNMENTAL WORK. WE WOULD HAVE TO NEGOTIATE AND SEE IF WE CAN GET A BETTER DEAL WITH THEM AS FAR AS RATES THAN OUR NORTON BLUE, BECAUSE OUR NORTON BLUES RATES ARE PRETTY HIGH. FOR AN ON SITE ALL THE TIME, YOU KNOW, CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE. SO ONE OF THE OTHER OPTIONS THAT WE BROUGHT UP FOR CITY COMMISSION TO CONSIDER IS CAMILLE WALLACE WAS HIRED AS MISTER CHESS ALREADY TALKED ABOUT IN THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE. SHE WORKED THERE FOR ABOUT EIGHT MONTHS. SHE COULD BE SET IN AS OR SHE COULD BE NAMED THE INTERIM CITY ATTORNEY FOR A PERIOD OF TIME WHEN SARAH'S CONTRACTS END, WHICH HER CONTRACT ENDS ON THE END OF THE DAY ON SEPTEMBER 10TH, AND TO THE TIME IN WHICH THE SEARCH FIRM CAN BRING SOMEBODY IN AND COMMISSION CAN APPROVE THEM. WE. I BOUNCED IT OFF OF OUR LABOR ATTORNEY AT ALLEN NORTON BLUE AND ASKED HIM TO TAKE A LOOK AT THE CHARTER, AND HE MENTIONED TO ME THAT THERE HE CAN STRUCTURE A TEMPORARY INTERIM LABOR AGREEMENT WITH HER, AS WELL AS A RESOLUTION TO ADDRESS ANY CONCERNS THAT THE CHARTER HAS. AND OUTSIDE OF THAT I'M HERE TO SEEK FEEDBACK FROM COMMISSION HOW YOU WOULD LIKE ME TO PROCEED AT THIS POINT. SO I, THE THE CHOICE OF CAMILLE WALLACE WHILE I THINK I'M QUITE SURE SHE'S A VERY, VERY COMPETENT ATTORNEY, I THINK IT, IT, IT GIVES THE APPEARANCE OF NOT INDEPENDENCE. BECAUSE IF YOU HAVE, IF YOU HAVE SOMEBODY IN THE CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE WITH THE BEST OF INTENTIONS OF THE CITY MANAGER AND MISS WALLACE ARE BEING SWITCHED OVER TO THE CITY. BECAUSE THIS COMMISSION HAS ALWAYS WANTED A VERY INDEPENDENT CITY ATTORNEY. AND I WOULD THINK, IF I AM UNAWARE WHETHER SHE IS INTERESTED IN THE PERMANENT JOB OR NOT. BUT IN EVEN IN THE INTERIM, I WOULD ASSUME THAT SHE WOULD BE GOING BACK TO THE CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE. SO I THINK I WOULD QUESTION HER ABILITY TO BE INDEPENDENT WITH HAVING NO CASTING, NO ASPERSIONS ON HER WISH TO BE INDEPENDENT. I JUST THINK THAT THAT WOULD BE A DIFFICULT THING TO DO, THAT THAT'S JUST THIS. THIS PARTICULAR ELECTED OFFICIALS VIEW. MADAM MAYOR. YES, SIR. WOULD THAT NOT ALSO, IN YOUR LOGIC, BE THE SAME THING AS THE ATTORNEY WHEN SHE WAS A SENIOR ATTORNEY IN ATTORNEY'S OFFICE, THEN WENT TO THE CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE. WOULD THAT THEN BE A CONFLICT IN THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION? OH, ANYTIME SOMEBODY GOES FROM ONE PLACE TO THE OTHER. I MEAN, SHE CHOSE. SHE CHOSE THAT. SHE CHOSE MANAGEMENT OVER BEING AN ATTORNEY. YEAH, BUT WITH YOUR LOGIC, I'M GOING BACK. NO, I DON'T I DON'T AGREE THAT THAT DOESN'T FOLLOW. FAIR ENOUGH. BUT ANYBODY ELSE HAVE ANY I MAYOR FIRST OFF, I'M GOING TO REITERATE MY POINT THAT THIS IS A SELF-INFLICTED WOUND ORCHESTRATED BY THE CITY COMMISSION TO PUT US IN THE POSITION OF HAVING NO LEGAL DEPARTMENT AND THE OUTSIDE INFLUENCERS THAT HAVE INFLUENCE OVER THE DECISIONS MADE AT THIS COMMISSION ARE CERTAINLY PLEASED WITH THIS PROSPECT, BECAUSE FROM THE DEVELOPMENT COMMUNITY, THEY ARE THRILLED WITH THE PROSPECT OF HAVING NO LEGAL DEPARTMENT AVAILABLE TO THE CITY OF FORT PIERCE WHEN IT COMES TO GENERATING AND PRODUCING DEVELOPER AGREEMENTS. THIS IS A FIELD DAY FOR THEM, AND THEY ARE LICKING THEIR CHOPS ABOUT GETTING THEIR WISHES MADE TRUE. IT'S A BAD SITUATION. THERE'S A LOCAL FIRM, SOMEWHAT LOCAL FIRM THAT YOU SAID YOU MENTIONED. YES, MA'AM. AND THAT HAS GOVERNMENT EXPERIENCE, IS IT DO THEY HAVE LOCAL GOVERNMENT EXPERIENCE IN TERMS OF WORKING FOR THE LOCAL GOVERNMENT OR. THEY ARE THEY HAVE EXPERIENCE BEING AN OUTSIDE FIRM, BEING THE CITY ATTORNEY BUT WORKING FOR THEIR FIRM NOT. YEAH. YOU UNDERSTAND LIKE A CONTRACT. YES, MA'AM. MADAM MAYOR. YES, SIR. SO SO I WANT TO EXPLORE THAT A LITTLE BIT MORE BECAUSE SHE KIND OF GAVE US A TOP LINE OF THAT, THIS FIRM OUT OF FORT LAUDERDALE. WHY? AND YOU I DON'T KNOW IF YOU MENTIONED THE NAME, BUT YOU DIDN'T GET INTO. AND I IT'S PROBABLY NOT THE TIME TO GET INTO WHAT THE RATE, BUT YOU KNOW, AS AN OPTION. TIME'S UP AS AN OPTION. HOW MUCH CAN YOU GIVE US MORE ABOUT, ABOUT THIS FIRM? [00:30:07] I CAN APPRECIATE YOU SAY THAT THEY'VE, THEY'VE OBVIOUSLY DONE THIS BEFORE. SO THE, I DID NOT SAY THE NAME, BUT THE FIRM'S NAME, AND I DON'T I DON'T IF YOU DON'T, I DON'T I DON'T WANT TO GET IN ANY QUAGMIRE OR IF WE'RE GOING TO ENTER INTO A CONTRACT, I PROBABLY BEST THAT WE HOLD THAT BACK AT THIS PARTICULAR POINT, JUST KIND OF GIVE ME WHAT YOU CAN ABOUT THE OPPORTUNITY HERE THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT. SO THE TWO PEOPLE THAT I REACHED OUT TO I DID TALK TO TWO FIRMS. YOU DID KNOW KNOW THE TWO PEOPLE THAT GAVE ME THE NAMES. ONE WAS FROM ALLEN NORTON AND BLUE. OKAY. AND IT WAS FROM OUR LABOR ATTORNEY. OKAY. AND HE GAVE ME THE NAME OF A FIRM THAT DOES BUSINESS FOR LOCAL GOVERNMENTS ALL THROUGHOUT THE STATE OF FLORIDA AND THEY'RE ON THE WEST COAST. AND I THOUGHT THAT WAS KIND OF FAR FOR US IN CASE WE NEEDED SOMEBODY TO BE HERE AND SUCH. SO IF WE WANT TO, I CAN HAVE HIM SEARCH AND GIVE US SOME ADDITIONAL OPTIONS. WE WOULD, WHOEVER WE ENDED UP GOING WITH, WE WOULD TRY TO HAVE TO NEGOTIATE RATES WITH THEM, RIGHT. AND SAY, OKAY, IF WE'RE GOING TO HAVE YOU BE, YOU KNOW, AN OUTSOURCED CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE FOR HERE, THIS IS WHAT WE NEED. HERE'S OUR SCOPE OF SERVICE AND SEE WHAT KIND OF RATES WE CAN GET. I DON'T, YOU KNOW, I DON'T KNOW. I CAN TELL YOU THAT THE GOING RATES ARE, YOU KNOW, WITHOUT SOME KIND OF CONTRACT WITH, YOU KNOW, WITHOUT NEGOTIATING DOWN, THEY GO FOR AROUND 275 TO 300, YOU KNOW, AN HOUR, WHICH CAN GET VERY EXPENSIVE VERY QUICKLY, ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU HAVE SOMEBODY ON SITE, YOU KNOW, ALL THE TIME. THE OTHER FIRM WAS GIVEN TO ME BY MISS NARLOCH. SHE MENTIONED THAT IT'S A FIRM DOWN HERE IN FORT LAUDERDALE, WHICH SHE BELIEVES HAS AN OFFICE IN SAINT LUCIE COUNTY. THAT DOES A LOT OF MUNICIPAL CONTRACTED WORK. SO THOSE ARE THE TWO INDIVIDUALS THAT GAVE ME THE INFORMATION. OKAY. AND I HAVEN'T DONE ANY OTHER INVESTIGATION OTHER THAN SEEK COMMISSION'S GUIDANCE ON HOW WOULD YOU LIKE ME TO HANDLE THIS? IF YOU WANT ME TO MOVE FORWARD WITH LOOKING INTO THAT, I CERTAINLY WILL SEE WHAT I COULD DO TO GATHER UP THEIR BACKGROUND AND IF THERE'S ANY OTHER FIRMS I CAN LOOK AT, IF YOU WANT ME TO TRY TO OUTSOURCE IT, I CAN DO THAT AND SEE WHAT KIND OF CONTRACTED DEALS OR SEE WHAT KIND OF DEALS WE CAN GET. I JUST NEED TO KNOW SOME DIRECTION. SO GO AHEAD. SO IF, IF WE LOOKED AT THAT OPTION OF THE FIRM OUT OF FORT LAUDERDALE, WE HAVEN'T EVEN BEGUN TO TALK TO THEM, NEGOTIATE ANY OF THOSE RATES OF THAT TO PUT TOGETHER A PROGRAM, PROBABLY A HYBRID. OBVIOUSLY, WE NEED PEOPLE HERE FOR COMMISSION MEETINGS AND FPR AND ALL THE OTHER STUFF WE COVER FROM THE LEGAL ASPECT. BUT THE DAY IN AND DAY OUT COULD BE ORCHESTRATED WITH THEIR OFFICE AND ROUTE IT THROUGH. HOWEVER WE ROUTE LEGAL STUFF. WE HAVE A LEGAL WAY OF SENDING STUFF. YES, SIR. A SYSTEM. I DO KNOW THAT MUCH. RIGHT. SO SO SO A HYBRID APPROACH COULD BE PUT INTO PLACE. SO AS THEY'RE THERE, THEY'RE AVAILABLE. AND THEN WE NEED TO KNOW WHAT THOSE BILLABLES ARE WHEN THEY HANDLE CITY OF FORT PIERCE BUSINESS. AND THAT'S WHAT YOU DON'T HAVE RIGHT NOW. RIGHT? RIGHT. OKAY. BECAUSE RIGHT NOW, WE DON'T HAVE THE CITY ATTORNEYS THAT ARE GOING TO BE ON SITE. WE CAN CERTAINLY POST FOR THOSE POSITIONS AND WE CAN START RECRUITING FOR THOSE POSITIONS. SURE. AND IDENTIFY, YOU KNOW, BRING ON CITY ATTORNEYS AND THEN IT CAN LIKE TO YOUR POINT, YOU CAN HAVE A HYBRID WHERE THEY'RE OUTSOURCING WHATEVER THEY CAN'T HANDLE. IN THE MEANTIME THE OTHER FIRM CAN REPRESENT US IN THE HIGH STAKE FIVE MEETINGS THAT ARE COMING UP HERE PRETTY SOON. RIGHT. THERE'S, THERE'S, THERE'S OPTIONS. YES, SIR. OKAY. SO I THINK IT TO DO US A SERVICE. I THINK AT SOME POINT WE HAVE TO EXPLORE THAT, RIGHT? WE HAVE TO HAVE THAT CONVERSATION WITH THIS, WITH THIS FIRM. NOW BACK TO THE POINT ABOUT MISS WALLACE, RIGHT. THAT WAS BROUGHT UP HERE. IN A SITUATION THAT WE'RE IN, WE HAVE INTERNAL CONTROLS. AND RIGHT NOW THERE ARE THINGS THAT NEED TO JUST BE PUSHED OUT, ROUTED TO DIFFERENT DEPARTMENTS FEEDBACK GIVEN OBVIOUSLY TO OUR DIRECTORS THAT HAVE QUESTIONS WHEN IT COMES TO LEGAL STUFF, PARTICULARLY IN-HOUSE LEGAL STUFF AND INTERPRETATION OF OUR CHARTER INTERPRETATION OF OUR PROCEDURES AND HOW WE DO THINGS HERE. SO, SO THAT'S NOT THAT'S, THAT'S NOT EVEN GOING TO COURT OR HAVING THAT, BUT SOMEONE THAT ACTUALLY COULD RECEIVE ANY CITATIONS THAT COME TO THE CITY IF WE'RE BEING SERVED, ETC.. SO MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT AS OF AS OF THAT CERTAIN DATE, WE DON'T WE WON'T HAVE ANYBODY DOWN THERE. CORRECT. AND SO, SO, SO YOU HAVE JUST RIGHT, RIGHT. AND, AND THE, THE CONVERSATION OF IT, OF THINKING THAT COULD SHE SIT IN THERE UNTIL WE GET SOMEBODY HERE? OBVIOUSLY, WE GOT AN AGGRESSIVE TIMELINE TO HAVE SOMEBODY IN HERE BY, BY NOVEMBER, THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO BE BROUGHT UP TO SPEED WHO'S MORE FAMILIAR WITH THE SYSTEMS THAN HER. SHE SPENT EIGHT MONTHS IN THERE WITH THE CITY ATTORNEY DOING CITY ATTORNEY WORK. NOW, AS FAR AS THE INDEPENDENCE BETWEEN THE CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE AND THE ATTORNEY'S OFFICE I'M STRUGGLING WITH THAT A LITTLE BIT FOR. THE SIMPLE REASON IS THAT. THEY TAKE ORDERS IN DIRECTION FROM THIS POLICY BOARD HERE. [00:35:08] HOW IS THAT GOING TO BE AN ISSUE WHEN IT COMES TO ANYTHING ELSE? I'M STRUGGLING WITH THAT BECAUSE WE HAVE INTERNAL SYSTEMS WHERE WE ROUTE STUFF AROUND THESE. THE DIRECTORS NEED LEGAL FEEDBACK. THEY GET THINGS EVERY DAY FROM THE PUBLIC, WHAT THEY'RE INTERPRETING, AND THEY NEED SOME TYPE OF SENSE OF DIRECTION. SO IF SOMEONE'S GOING TO WALK AWAY AND GO AWAY FROM THE CITY ATTORNEY, I MEAN THE CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE AND GO INTO THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE JUST FOR A MATTER OF 3 OR 4 MONTHS UNTIL WE GET A CITY ATTORNEY ON BOARD. THAT'S AN OPTION FOR ME. SO I HEAR AND I CAN APPRECIATE THAT, BUT AND I HAVE NO PROBLEMS. IF WE WANT TO ASK MISS WALLACE ABOUT IT. I DON'T THINK SHE HAS ANY INTENTIONS. I CAN'T SPEAK FOR HER. BUT SHE LEFT THAT OFFICE TO GO TO THE CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE TO BE THE DEPUTY CITY MANAGER. AND, YOU KNOW, THIS IS A SITUATION WHERE THIS CITY HAS TAKEN ALL KIND OF OUR EMPLOYEES AND ASKED THEM TO DO THINGS TO FILL THE GAPS WHEN WE WERE IN NEED. WE'VE ASKED PEOPLE THAT WERE PUBLIC WORKS DIRECTORS TO BE OUT THERE BEING A SAFETY OFFICER. AND SO WE'RE IN A SITUATION RIGHT NOW. YES. WE KNEW WHEN WE HAD THIS CONVERSATION THREE, FOUR MONTHS AGO THAT WE WOULD REACH THIS POINT. WE'RE AT A POINT NOW WHERE EVERYONE IS AFFORDING TO OPTION OUT OF LEAVING THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE. AND THAT'S THEIR OPTION FOR WHATEVER REASON THEY WANT TO LEAVE, THEY CAN LEAVE. BUT THIS SHIP MUST STILL CONTINUE TO SAIL ON. AND TO ME, THE PATHWAY TO DO THAT IS TO ALWAYS CONTINUE TO ASK OUR EMPLOYEES TO STEP UP AND FILL A GAP LIKE THEY HAVE ALWAYS DONE. WE HAVE MANY PEOPLE IN THIS ORGANIZATION THAT'S DOING WAY MORE THAN THEIR JOB TITLE, AND THEY GO BACK TO DOING IT. WE'VE HAD SEAN COSS COME OUT OF THE BUILDING AND GO FILL IN TO OUR CODE. IF SHE'S A LAWYER AND SHE'S CERTIFIED TO BE A LAWYER IN THE STATE OF FLORIDA, THAT WOULD BE THE ONLY CHALLENGE I WOULD HAVE. IS SHE QUALIFIED TO AT LEAST FILL THIS GAP, TO GET US OVER THIS BRIDGE FOR THESE 2 TO 3 MONTHS. THANK YOU, MADAM MAYOR. YES, SIR. MR. SORENSEN, SO IN THE THEORY OF HIRING AN OUTSIDE FIRM. I WOULD CONSIDER THAT. WHO WERE THEY EMPLOYED BY? THE OUTSIDE FIRM? YES, THEY'RE EMPLOYED BY THE COMMISSION. AND WHO DO THEY TAKE DIRECTION FROM? COMMISSION. I FIND THAT VERY DIFFICULT TO BELIEVE, BUT LET'S LET'S SAY THAT'S THE FACT. I AGREE WITH THE MAYOR'S POSITION THAT MOVING THE ASSISTANT CITY MANAGER TO BACK TO THE LEGAL DEPARTMENT, THERE'S THERE'S DEFINITIVE CONFLICT THERE. AND THE INDEPENDENCE OF THAT CHARTER OFFICER, AS FAR AS I'M CONCERNED, IS NOT IN EXISTENCE. THAT'S MY OPINION ON THE MATTER. SO I DO NOT SHARE YOUR YOUR OPINION AS FAR AS HOW THAT WOULD WORK INDEPENDENTLY IN THE INTERIM. SO IN ESSENCE, WE HAVE TWO CHARTER OFFICERS AT THAT TIME. IS THAT A FAIR ASSESSMENT? AN INDEPENDENT AN INTERIM CITY ATTORNEY IS NOT GOING TO BE A CHARTER OFFICER. SO GETTING INTO THE WEEDS I TALKED WITH THE ATTORNEY OUT OF TALLAHASSEE AND HE'S EXPLAINED TO ME HE DID A CHARTER REVIEW AND HE EXPLAINED TO ME WHAT WOULD HAVE TO HAPPEN. AND HE'S GIVEN ME LIKE A PROPOSED LANGUAGE THAT WOULD HAVE TO BE, BUT BASICALLY MISS WALLACE WOULD HAVE TO TAKE A LEAVE OF ABSENCE AND BE NAMED THE CITY ATTORNEY. BUT GOING UNDER THE INTERIM CITY ATTORNEY SO THAT THERE IS NO CONFLICT WITH THE CHARTER, SHE WOULD HAVE TO TAKE A LEAVE OF ABSENCE. AND IN HER CONTRACT WOULD SAY BASICALLY AT THE END OF THAT, THEN SHE WOULD GO BACK TO, YOU KNOW, IF SHE'S TERMINATED OR WHATEVER, SHE WOULD GO BACK TO THE CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE. OKAY. AND ONE OTHER THING. I KNOW THAT THIS INFORMATION I DIDN'T WANT TO BE DISCLOSED TO ME, BUT YOU HAD ASSURED ME THAT ALL COSTS ASSOCIATED WITH THIS SEARCH, ENGAGEMENT, OUTSIDE LEGAL SERVICES, ETC., BECAUSE WE'RE CONSULTING WITH AN OUTSIDE LABOR ATTORNEY. CORRECT. SO THAT'S RUNNING THE CLOCK THERE AS WELL. SO IT'S NOT JUST $31,000. THERE'S MORE MONEY ON TOP OF THAT THAT'S BEING EXPENDED. THERE'S A CODE THAT'S BEEN CREATED BY FINANCE, WHICH I'M GOING TO PUT IN THE RECORD. I WANT THAT INFORMATION AT THE APPROPRIATE TIME. I WILL REQUEST IT SPECIFICALLY AND I BEST GET IT. OKAY. I'LL JUST LEAVE IT AT THAT. THANK YOU. YES, SIR. ANYBODY ELSE? YES, SIR. MR. SORENSEN HAVE YOU SPOKEN TO MISS WALLACE? WITH THE INTEREST OF TEMPORARILY TAKING THE POSITION. I HAVE, YES, SIR. AND HER ANSWER IS IF I HATE TO SPEAK FOR HER, BUT HER ANSWER IS YES, I WILL DO IT BECAUSE SHE WANTS TO DO WHAT'S RIGHT FOR THE [00:40:03] CITY AND HELP OUT. SHE IS NOT INTERESTED IN THE POSITION LONG TERM. SECONDLY THE CHARTER RULES HERE, I THINK I HEARD THAT FROM YOU FROM THE OUTSIDE COUNSEL. AND THIS GOES BACK TO THE ORIGINAL QUESTION ABOUT THE CHARTER AND THE SEPARATION OF POWERS DECISION MAKER ADVISORY AND OR RECORD KEEPING. THOSE THREE POSITIONS MAINTAIN THOSE THREE POSITIONS IN, IN THEIR WORKFORCE AND WHAT THEY DO. ONE IS A DECISION MAKER AND THE CITY MANAGER, THE CITY ATTORNEY IS AN ADVISOR AND THE CLERK IS RECORD KEEPING AND AND MANAGING WHAT THE CLERK DOES. SO THERE'S SEPARATION OF POWERS. ONCE AN INDIVIDUAL GOES FROM THE CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE TO THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE, THERE'S A PROVISION IN THE CITY CHARTER. AND THE CITY CHARTER IS WHAT RULES. AND THAT PERSON WOULD HAVE TO MAINTAIN THOSE POSITIONS AND THOSE REQUIREMENTS UNDER THE CHARTER. THAT BEING SAID. ASIDE FROM WHAT WE'RE GOING THROUGH RIGHT THIS MINUTE, THAT'S FLORIDA LEAGUE OF CITIES. I ASKED THE DIRECT QUESTION OF A PANEL ABOUT A SCENARIO THAT WE'RE DEALING WITH TODAY, AND THE ISSUE IS MANAGING THE CITY CHARTER. AND SO AFTER THIS MEETING IS OVER, I'M GOING TO ASK FOR AN AGENDA ITEM TO BE PLACED THAT THE CITY COMMISSION LOOKED TO HAVE A CHARTER REVIEW FROM EXPERTS FROM THE FLORIDA LEAGUE OF CITIES, SO THAT WE CAN, ONCE AND FOR ALL, HAVE A CLEAR DEFINITION OF WHAT THE CHARTER IS, WHO'S RESPONSIBLE FOR WHAT, WHO'S THE DECISION MAKER, WHO'S AN ADVISOR, WHO'S RECORD KEEPING, ETC.. NOW, AS FOR A TEMPORARY SCENARIO THE CITY WHEN I WAS A COUNTY COMMISSIONER HAD TAPPED THE COUNTY COMMISSION ATTORNEY'S OFFICE FOR SUPPORT AND BACKUP. THAT WAS DONE ON TWO DIFFERENT OCCASIONS THAT I RECALL. AND THE PERSON THAT WAS INTERESTED IN THE JOB ORIGINALLY, MR. MCINTYRE SAT IN THAT SEAT OVER THERE ON MULTIPLE OCCASIONS. SO THERE HAVE BEEN SITUATIONS IN WHICH THE COUNTY PARTICIPATED IN SUPPORTING A CITY WITHIN ITS COUNTY. AND SO THAT CONVERSATION MAY NEED TO HAPPEN WITH THE COUNTY AS WELL. SO THERE'S, THERE'S AN OPTION THERE. THERE ARE MULTIPLE ATTORNEYS OVER THERE TODAY WHERE THERE WEREN'T AS FAR AS 4 OR 5 YEARS AGO, THERE WERE MORE ATTORNEYS THERE NOW THAN THERE EVER WERE. THAT BEING SAID WE CAN BEAT THIS. NO, I'M NOT GOING TO GET INVOLVED IN THIS. I'M NOT GOING TO SAY ANYTHING ABOUT ANIMALS AND THE BEATINGS. BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY, I KNOW. SORRY, IT'S A BAD JOKE, BUT I GOT TO LIGHTEN IT UP IN HERE BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, ON ONE SIDE OF THIS DAIS CERTAIN PEOPLE ARE BEING ATTACKED AND I CAN TAKE THE ATTACKS. AND I THINK THAT'S WHERE IT'S GENERATED AND THAT'S WHERE IT'S COMING FROM. SO THAT BEING SAID, THE HOCUS POCUS OR THE IDEA THAT A CITY COMMISSION MAY HAVE MADE A DECISION BECAUSE THEY WANT DEVELOPERS TO HAVE A HAND OR AN UPPER HAND IN THIS COMMISSION CHAMBERS IS RIDICULOUS. THE FACT IS, IS IF, IF THAT WAS THE CASE AND DEVELOPERS WERE TRYING TO PUSH AN ISSUE WITH THE WORKLOAD THAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN OR SLOW DOWN, I THINK DEVELOPERS ARE NOT GOING TO BE AS HAPPY AS MY COLLEAGUE HAS INTENDED TO MAKE IT SOUND. THAT'S NOT IT AT ALL. AND QUITE HONESTLY, I ASKED DIRECT QUESTIONS OF OUR PLANNING STAFF WHEN WE WERE TALKING ABOUT CAUSEWAY COVE DIRECT QUESTIONS ABOUT ATTORNEY REVIEW OF THE ENTIRE PROCESS, WHICH WAS CAUSEWAY COVE. AND NOR DID I HEAR. I DID NOT HEAR ONE STATEMENT THAT A CITY ATTORNEY OR AN OUTSIDE COUNSEL HAD REVIEWED ALL OF THE INFORMATION IN THE CAUSEWAY COVE DECISION TO MOVE IT ON. SO IF THAT'S THE CASE, THEN THE IDEA THAT THIS COMMISSION IS BEING HELD UP BY DEVELOPERS AGAIN IS RIDICULOUS. IF THAT CONVERSATION HAPPENED ON CAUSEWAY COVE AND NO ATTORNEY REVIEWED AND THERE WAS NO FINAL DECISIONS BY OUTSIDE COUNSEL IT'S LUDICROUS. SO THAT BEING SAID I THINK IT'S TIME WE MOVE FORWARD. I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO MOVE ON, GET THE PROCESS STARTED. IF MISS WALLACE WOULD BE INTERESTED IN THE POSITION FOR A TEMPORARY STATE FOR TEMPORARY STATE OF AFFAIRS, THEN I WOULD LIKE TO. AFTER COMMENTS ARE MADE BY THE COMMISSION, MOVE FORWARD WITH A MOTION TO ACCEPT THAT SCENARIO IN WHICH MISS WALLACE WOULD TAKE THE TEMPORARY POSITION UNDER THE CHARTER. POSITIONS OF THE OUTSIDE COUNCIL AND MOVE FORWARD WITH THE REVIEW AND THE [00:45:04] RECRUITMENT OF A FULL TIME CITY ATTORNEY. THANK YOU. MAYOR. MR. GAINES. MADAM MAYOR, I'VE BEEN QUIET AND JUST LISTENING. I HAVE TO FOLLOW WHAT COMMISSIONER JOHNSON, I'M TRYING TO COMPLEX ABOUT THE CONFLICT OF INTEREST. BECAUSE WHEN WE LOST OUR CITY MANAGER, WE HAD A CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICER GO IN AS INTERIM CITY MANAGER FROM HER CONSTITUTIONAL POSITION OF CITY CLERK. AND NOT ONE TIME DURING THAT MOVE DID I HEAR ANYTHING ABOUT CONFLICTS THAT HAD ANYTHING ABOUT CHARTER OFFICERS OR ANYTHING. IT WAS A MOVE THAT IT WENT IN. IT WAS PRESENTED AND WHAT WE DID WAS FOR THE BETTERMENT OF THE CITY. WE SAID, OKAY, LET HER MOVE INTO THE INTERIM AND KEEP THE CITY RUNNING AS THE CITY, AS THE AS THE INTERIM CITY MANAGER. AND WE APPOINTED SOMEBODY IN HER POSITION OR WE, I THINK WE DID TO DO THE CITY CLERK THAT WAS. BUT I MIGHT BE WRONG ON THAT. I CAN'T GO BACK THAT FAR. I'M TRYING TO REMEMBER PUTTING EVERYTHING TOGETHER. BUT THE CITY DIDN'T MISS A BEAT. WE KEPT RUNNING. SO WE HAVE SOMEBODY WHO IS WILLING TO GO BACK INTO THAT OFFICE TO KEEP THE CITY RUNNING. AS A CITY ATTORNEY HERE, NO ONE IS GOING TO RISK THEIR BAR LICENSE IN THE STATE OF FLORIDA PLAYING POLITICS WITH THE CITY. I CAN TELL YOU, HAVING SPOKEN TO MISS WALLACE. BUT I CAN TELL YOU SHE'S NOT GOING TO LOSE HER BAR LICENSE DEALING WITH POLITICS OF CITY OF FORT PIERCE. I'M NOT GOING TO LOSE MY BAR LICENSE WITH THE CITY POLITICS OF FORT PIERCE. SO THAT WAS UNFAIR TO HER TO SAY THAT SHE COULDN'T GO OVER THERE AND NOT MAINTAIN HER PROFESSIONALISM AS AS AN ATTORNEY AND NOT BE BEHOLDEN TO CITY MANAGER OR HR OR WHATEVER. IF YOU KNOW HER AND SHE'S BEEN HERE LONG ENOUGH FOR EVERYBODY TO KNOW HER, ALL OF US KNOW THAT'S NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. SO WITH THAT SAID, YOU KNOW, I'M READY TO MOVE ON. AND MY COMMISSIONER SITTING NEXT TO ME JUST SAID ABOUT THE DEVELOPERS, I HOPE THEY'RE NOT OUT THERE DOING THAT BECAUSE IT'S NOT GOING TO BE THAT WAY, BUT I'LL LEAVE THAT ALONE. I DON'T KNOW, I DON'T KNOW WHERE THAT INFORMATION COMES FROM OR IT'S COMING FROM. I DON'T KNOW WHERE A LOT OF STUFF BEING SAID TODAY IS COMING FROM. SO I JUST NEEDED TO SAY THAT THAT WE'VE DONE THIS IN THE PAST, IT HASN'T BEEN ALL OF THIS FRICTION AND WE'VE TRIED TO KEEP THE CITY RUNNING. SO I'M SUGGESTING WE DO THE SAME THING. MADAM MAYOR, I JUST HAVE A QUESTION. I'M UNCLEAR BECAUSE YOU ASKED THE QUESTION. I JUST WANT TO BE CLEAR. I THINK SOME MOTIONS ARE COMING. YOU TALKED WITH THE LABOR ATTORNEY WHO INTERPRETED OUR CHARTER, RIGHT, AS FAR AS THIS. AND SO THE PATHWAY, IF THIS WAS TO GO, WOULD ALLOW FOR HER. WHAT WHAT WOULD IT ALLOW IF IT WENT THAT WAY? WOULD SHE BE A CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICER, NOT A CONSTITUTIONAL. JUST A TEMPORARY ATTORNEY FILLING IN. WOULD SHE HAVE THE POWER OF ONE OF THE THREE? I DON'T KNOW, IT WOULD BE THE CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICER REPORTING TO CITY COMMISSION, INDEPENDENT FROM THE OTHER CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS. OKAY. BECAUSE SHE WOULD TAKE A LEAVE OF ABSENCE FROM HER POSITION AND SHE WOULD BE OVER THERE, AT WHICH TIME SHE WOULD BE A CONTRACT EMPLOYEE. THE CITY COMMISSION, BASED ON THAT, COULD TERMINATE HER. BUT IN HER AGREEMENT, SHE WOULD HAVE A CLAUSE THAT IF THE CITY OTHER THAN, YOU KNOW, IF SHE'S ARRESTED, YOU KNOW, THE. I FORGET THE TERMS THAT ARE IN THE THE STATE. HELP ME OUT WITH THAT ONE. I DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY ARE, BUT A CERTAIN TERMS THAT WOULD DICTATE HER CRIMINAL OFFENSES ARE CRIMINAL OFFENSES WOULD SEPARATE THAT. STOP THE CONTRACT. SHE WOULD LOSE HER JOB ENTIRELY FROM THE CITY. BUT IF YOU JUST DECIDED THAT HER TO DO THAT, YOU KNOW, FOR NO CAUSE YOU JUST DIDN'T WANT HER TO BE THE CITY ATTORNEY ANYMORE, OKAY? YOU COULD TERMINATE HER AT ANY TIME AND SHE WOULD JUST GO RIGHT BACK TO UNDER THE CONTRACT. SHE WOULD GO RIGHT BACK TO HER POSITION IN DCM, AND THE POSITION IN THE CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE WOULD JUST STAY OPEN. IT WOULDN'T BE FILLED. OKAY. AND THEN THIS CONTRACT PROPOSES THERE A CERTAIN LIMIT OF TIME SCOPE, MEANING WE HAVE A PRETTY AGGRESSIVE TIMELINE. SO IS IT A CONTRACT WITH LIKE THREE MONTHS OR TWO MONTHS OR WHATEVER THAT IS TO GIVE SOME WE COULD PROPOSE I IT'S UP TO THE CITY COMMISSION, BUT I CAN PROPOSE A TIMELINE TO HER THAT SHE WOULD JUST STAY THAT UNTIL WE ACTUALLY GET SOMEBODY HIRED. OKAY. AND APPROVED BY CITY COMMISSION, AT WHICH TIME THE CONTRACT UPON THAT WOULD END. WE CAN WORD IT LIKE THAT. WE CAN MAKE IT FOR. HOWEVER, COMMISSION WOULD LIKE TO MAKE. RIGHT. AND SO CERTAINLY I'M COMFORTABLE WITH THAT. AND I THINK I HEARD YOU OPINE THAT SHE IS NOT INTERESTED IN THIS POSITION AND WILL NOT BE APPLYING. AND THAT TO ME, COMMISSIONERS IS SOMETHING THAT I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH PUTTING IT IN THE CONTRACT AS WELL. [00:50:03] RIGHT. I THINK IN THIS PARTICULAR SITUATION, WE'RE TRYING TO JUST PLUG A GAP, KEEP STUFF GOING, ROUTING THROUGH R, L, S OR WHATEVER WE CALL IT AROUND HERE AND GOING FROM THERE. I THINK I DON'T NOT TO SPEAK FOR HER, BUT I THINK IF YOU WERE TO ASK HER DIRECTLY IF SHE'S INTERESTED IN THE POSITION, SHE WILL TELL YOU NO, BUT THAT SHE IS INTERESTED IN HELPING THE CITY AND DOING IT FOR THIS PERIOD OF TIME JUST TO KIND OF HELP THE CITY MOVE ALONG, AT WHICH TIME SHE'LL BE HAPPY TO GO BACK. HER POSITION ALSO IN THE IN THE RESOLUTION AND IN THE CONTRACT, IT WOULD BE SPECIFICALLY CLEAR THAT THERE IS A CLAUSE IN THERE. IT SAYS RECRUITMENT OF A PERMANENT CITY ATTORNEY. THIS COMMISSIONS RECRUITMENT AND SELECTION PROCESS FOR PERMANENT CITY ATTORNEY SHALL CONTINUE WITHOUT INTERRUPTION DURING THE TERM OF THIS AGREEMENT. SO WE WILL CONTINUE ON JUST AS WHAT WE'RE DOING AND WOULDN'T HAVE ANY EFFECT WITH HER. OKAY. CAN I JUST MAKE A COMMENT? MR. CHESS, NO ONE'S GOING TO LIKE THIS COMMENT. BUT I'M GOING TO TAKE A STEP BACK. WHEN I HIRED SEAN COS TO BE THE INTERIM CODE ENFORCEMENT COMMUNITY RESPONSE DIRECTOR, NOBODY TOLD ME SEVERAL TIMES, I DON'T WANT THAT POSITION. I DON'T WANT THAT POSITION. I DON'T WANT THAT POSITION. AFTER THREE MONTHS. YOU KNOW WHAT? HE WANTED THAT POSITION. SO THESE INDIVIDUALS HAVE CAREERS. THEY SHOULD BE ABLE TO MAKE A CAREER CHOICE. MRS WAS EXPRESSED TO ME THAT SHE DOES NOT WANT THAT POSITION. UNTIL THEY GET IT RIGHT. THEY GET, OKAY, I CAN DO THIS JOB. OKAY. THEY HAD RESOURCES AROUND THEM. THEY WERE WORKING WITH THE COMMISSION. SO I DON'T THINK WE SHOULD BE LIMITING THE ABILITY OF OUR EMPLOYEES TO MAKE CAREER DECISIONS, AND WE DON'T WANT HER TO HAVE THAT POSITION. YOU DON'T YOU DON'T HIRE HER. WE SHOULDN'T SAY SHE SHOULD NOT BE ABLE TO PUT HER HAT AS A CANDIDATE, ALTHOUGH SHE EXPRESSED CLEARLY SHE DOES NOT WANT IT. BUT I HEARD THAT BEFORE I HAD ENOUGH PROFESSIONAL STAFF IN MY CAREER WHO I PUT IN INTERIM ROLES WHO SAID, I DON'T WANT THE JOB AFTER 2 OR 3 MONTHS. YOU KNOW WHAT? THEY WANT THE JOB. AND WHO ARE WE TO SAY THEY CAN'T APPLY FOR IT? NOW, I DON'T HIRE THEM, BUT WE SHOULD BE CAREFUL ABOUT LIMITING OUR STAFF'S ABILITY TO MAKE CAREER CHOICES. SHE MRS WAS MADE A CAREER CHOICE TO COME TO THE CITY. I DON'T WANT TO LOSE. I DON'T WANT HER OVER THERE. I'D RATHER HAVE. BECAUSE NOW I'M DOING ALL THE WORK THAT SHE WAS BEING TRAINED TO DO. BUT IT'S IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE CITY. I CAN'T WAIT TO GET HER BACK IF SHE RETURNS, BUT WE HAVE TO BE VERY CAREFUL ABOUT TELLING STAFF THEY CANNOT APPLY FOR POSITIONS BECAUSE WE THINK THERE'S A CONFLICT OF INTEREST. THEY ARE PROFESSIONAL, THEY MAKE PROFESSIONAL, THEY HAVE JUDGMENT TO MAKE. THEY UNDERSTAND OUR POLICIES, OUR PROCEDURES, STATE LAW, OUR ORDINANCES. SO I JUST I'M TAKEN ABACK BY THESE COMMENTS THAT SHE AND JARED. ALL DUE RESPECT, SIR, YOU DON'T SPEAK FOR MISS WALLACE. SHE SPEAKS FOR HERSELF. AND SHE TOLD ME SHE DOESN'T WANT LIKE SHE TOLD YOU. BUT I TAKE THAT WITH A GRAIN OF SALT BECAUSE. HEY, I'VE SEEN IT. I'VE HEARD IT DOWN THE ROAD. I THINK I WANT THIS POSITION, AND THEN WE'RE GONNA SAY, WELL, IN THE CITY COMMISSION, THE HR MANAGER SAID SHE DIDN'T WANT THE POSITION. YOU CAN'T APPLY FOR IT. WE HAVE TO BE CAREFUL ABOUT THAT. I'M JUST DISTURBED BY THAT. EVERY STAFF THAT WORKS FOR ME AND WHEN SHE GOES TO SEE THE ATTORNEY, SHE WILL NOT BE WORKING FOR ME. EVERY STAFF THAT WORKS FOR RICHARD CHASE HAS AN OPPORTUNITY TO MOVE UP IN THEIR CAREER AND PIVOT AND MAKE CAREER MOVES. THAT'S WHAT OUR RESPONSIBILITY IS TO DEVELOP OUR STAFF, GIVE THEM OPPORTUNITY TO GROW AND DEVELOP. IF SHE WANTS TO PIVOT BACK TO CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE, THAT SHOULD BE HER CHOICE. ALTHOUGH SHE EXPRESSED CLEARLY SHE DOES NOT WANT TO DO THAT TODAY. OKAY, SO THAT IS NOT GOING TO BE TAKEN WELL, BUT I WANT TO PUT IT OUT THERE. I WANT TO GO ON THE RECORD. SHE GETS TO MAKE A CHOICE AND EVERYBODY'S ALLOWED TO CHANGE THEIR MIND. I WANT TO JUST THROW OUT A COUPLE OF THINGS. SO I JUST WANT TO BE CLEAR. WHEN MISS COX TOOK OVER AS CITY MANAGER, SHE WAS ACTING. SHE COULDN'T BE INTERIM BECAUSE I THINK THERE'S A STATE LAW THAT YOU CAN'T SERVE IN TWO POSITIONS. IS THAT RIGHT, MISS HEDGES? I'M TRYING TO REMEMBER. YES, MADAM MAYOR. COMMISSIONERS. YES. IF YOU ALL RECALL, WE DID AN ANALYSIS ON THE ACTING VERSUS THE INTERIM. AND SO MISS COX WAS THE ACTING CITY MANAGER. THAT WAS WHILE MR. MIMS WAS ON ADMINISTRATIVE LEAVE. ONCE HIS EMPLOYMENT WAS TERMINATED, YOU DID HAVE TO APPOINT AN INTERIM CITY MANAGER, WHICH ENDED UP BEING MR. JOHNSON. THERE IS A MEMO THAT WE OBTAINED FROM OUTSIDE COUNSEL ON THAT DUAL OFFICE HOLDING ISSUE. SO I CAN FIND THAT AND RECIRCULATE IT TO THE COMMISSION. I KNOW COMMISSIONER ZYDOWSKY IS NEW SINCE THEN, SO I CAN RECIRCULATE THAT. BUT I DO BELIEVE THAT WHAT MR. SORENSEN IS TALKING ABOUT WITH THE LEAVE OF ABSENCE IS MEANT TO SOLVE THAT DUAL OFFICE HOLDING ISSUE. RIGHT. NOT HAVING BEEN INVOLVED IN THOSE CONVERSATIONS, BUT I PRESUME THAT'S WHAT HE AND OUTSIDE COUNSEL ARE GETTING AT. RIGHT. I PRESUME THAT, TOO. I JUST WANTED TO MAKE A DISTINCTION BETWEEN INTERIM AND ACTIVE, AND THIS WOULD BE WHAT WE NEED RIGHT NOW BECAUSE THE POSITION WILL BE VACANT, WILL BE INTERIM. IS THAT CORRECT? IS THAT CORRECT? CORRECT. YEAH. AND SO I ALSO WANT TO I IF WE HAVE SOMEBODY. I WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT YOU ALWAYS DO NEED INDEPENDENT CHARTER OFFICERS. I. I'M NOT CONVINCED WITH THE BEST OF INTENTIONS OF MR. CHESS AND MISS WALLACE, I THINK IT'S A DIFFICULT ASK OF ANYBODY TO SERVE TWO MASTERS, EVEN THOUGH SHE WILL BE. SHE WILL BE WORKING EXCLUSIVELY IF IF THIS IS WHAT THE WILL OF THE COMMISSION, IT SOUNDS LIKE IT IS, [00:55:05] WOULD BE WORKING FOR THE COMMISSION. BUT ALWAYS WITH AN EYE TOWARD RETURNING TO THE CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE. I JUST FEEL LIKE THAT THAT'S SOMETHING THAT IS INHERENT IN AND I'M, I'M SURPRISED THAT THE OUTSIDE LABOR ATTORNEY THINKS THAT THAT'S POSSIBLE. BUT THAT IS I WAS NOT PART OF THAT CONVERSATION. SO YES, I'LL COMMENT. THE OUTSIDE DEVELOPMENT COMMUNITY IS SALIVATING AT THE SITUATION THAT IT FINDS ITSELF IN WITH CITY HALL. CURRENTLY WITH NO LEGAL DEPARTMENT, NO LEGAL REPRESENTATION, NO CHARTER OFFICER IN IN THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE. AND THIS INFLUENCE WILL BE BORNE OUT. I'LL JUST PUT IT OUT THERE. AND THIS IS JUST MY OPINION. SO I'M NOT GOING TO GET JAMMED UP HERE, IN MY OPINION, SOLELY WHAT WILL TAKE PLACE. WHILE WE DO NOT HAVE A CITY ATTORNEY IN PLACE TO GIVE US PROPER GUIDANCE, IS THAT THE KING'S LANDING DEAL WILL BE KILLED BY THE CITY COMMISSION. THE SOUTH BEACH OVERLAY, WITH HEIGHT RESTRICTIONS FOR CONSTRUCTION WILL BE REMOVED. SO IT'S OFF TO THE RACES OUT ON SOUTH BEACH TO BUILD AS HIGH AND AS INTENSE AS THEY AS DEVELOPERS WISH. WE DO NOT HAVE LEGAL REPRESENTATION TO GUIDE US THROUGH THIS PROCESS, NOR WILL WE IN THE. IN THE MEANTIME, TO. WHILE THESE APPLICATIONS ARE COMING FORWARD AND THAT'S MY CONCERN. AND IT'LL BE BORNE OUT BY HOW THESE VOTES TAKE PLACE IN THE VERY NEAR FUTURE. SO TIME WILL TELL IF MY PROGNOSTICATIONS ARE CORRECT OR NOT. AND AGAIN, THIS IS SOLELY MY OPINION AND WE WILL WAIT TO SEE HOW IT WORKS ITSELF OUT. MADAM MAYOR. ALRIGHTY. COMMISSIONER SADOWSKI, IN RESPONSE TO MY COLLEAGUE. FIRST OF ALL KING'S LANDING KILLED ITSELF. CORRECT. IT WAS NOT FUNDED PROPERLY. PAST ACTIONS WERE TO CONTINUE TO TRY AND RESUSCITATE A DEAL THAT WAS. MAYBE ILL ADVISED. FIRST AND FOREMOST, I SPENT A GREAT DEAL OF TIME, AND I ENCOURAGE YOU TO GO GET US A PUBLIC RECORDS REQUEST OF THE INFORMATION THAT I PROVIDED TO CLARK THE NIGHT OF THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT. APPROVAL OF CAUSEWAY COVE. I HAD A SERIES OF QUESTIONS. I THINK THERE WERE 16 OR 18 OF THOSE QUESTIONS WHICH INCLUDED SOUTH BEACH OVERLAY, WHICH INCLUDED A REVIEW, A LEGAL REVIEW OF THE CAUSEWAY COVE APPROVAL. ADMINISTRATIVE APPROVAL. I QUESTIONED THE VALIDITY OF THE A2 COMPONENT OF THE DENSITY AND THE HEIGHT RESTRICTIONS OR HEIGHT NON RESTRICTIONS AT 200FT. BUT IT SEEMED VERY CLEAR THAT MY COLLEAGUE, WHO IS QUESTIONING THE VALIDITY OF SOME OF HIS COLLEAGUES UP HERE, DIDN'T STAND UP TO IT, DIDN'T ASK FOR CONTINUING CONVERSATION, DID NOT HELP TO SUPPORT THE IDEA THAT THIS THIS CAUSEWAY COVE WAS NOT IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE CITY, NOR DID IT MEET THE REQUIREMENTS OF. THE STATE CODE. THE STATE STATUTE LIVE LOCAL. IT'S INTERESTING, MADAM MAYOR, CAN I RESPOND TO THAT, PLEASE? IT'S IN THE RECORD. MY MY OPPOSITION TO THE CAUSEWAY COVE PROJECT. IT'S IT'S IT'S IN THE RECORD. CLEARLY, MY OPPOSITION TO THE REMOVAL OF THE SOUTH BEACH OVERLAY, ALL OF WHICH IS GOING TO COME TO FRUITION. HOWEVER, THE STATE HAD APPROVAL PROCESS OVER THE CAUSEWAY COVE PROJECT. NOT THIS BODY. PERIOD. THAT'S WHERE IT STARTS. THAT'S WHERE IT ENDS. IT DID NOT. IT DID NOT. IT DID NOT INVOLVE THIS COMMISSION AT ALL. WE HAD NO VOTE TO TAKE ON THAT PROJECT, PERIOD. CLEARLY. BUT I VOICED MY OPPOSITION TO THAT PROJECT FROM DAY ONE. I'VE NEVER CHANGED MY POSITION, AND I WILL CONTINUE IN THAT SAME VEIN. AND FOR THE RECORD. COULD WE PLEASE GET CAN WE GET BACK TO THE TALKING ABOUT. YEAH. COULD WE GET BACK TO THE SUBJECT AT HAND, PLEASE? YOU DID. I DID NOT BRING IT UP. CURTIS DID. HE BROUGHT IT UP. YOU BROUGHT IT UP. GENTLEMEN, GENTLEMEN, GET BACK TO. HOLD ON, HOLD ON. MADAM MAYOR, WE'VE HAD A SENSE OF DECORUM. WE CAN BE CIVIL UP HERE, BUT THE PROFANITY. THERE'S NOTHING THAT'S NOT CALLED FOR, SIR. CALL ME OFF THE COMMISSION. NO, I DON'T, I DON'T I DON'T THROW YOU. I DON'T THROW NOBODY AT THE COMMISSION. YEAH, SIR. SIR. I HOPE SO. MADAM. MADAM MAYOR, CAN I JUST MAKE A COMMENT, PLEASE? MR. CHAIRMAN, I JUST WANT TO SPEAK ON BEHALF OF MISS WALLACE. HER COMPETENCE. IF I, AS A CITY MANAGER AND I WORKED WITH HER SEVERAL MONTHS NOW, DIDN'T THINK SHE WAS COMPETENT ENOUGH TO TAKE OVER ROLE AS A CITY ATTORNEY. I WOULD NOT EVEN BE SUGGESTING THAT THAT MOVE BE MADE. SO I DON'T APPRECIATE THE COMMENTS THAT WE DON'T HAVE A CITY ATTORNEY. SHE'S JUST AS COMPETENT AS OUR CURRENT CITY ATTORNEY, MORE SO IN CERTAIN AREAS. [01:00:01] SO I'M JUST GOING TO BE STRAIGHT WITH THIS. IF SHE WASN'T QUALIFIED OR CAPABLE, WELL, CAPABLE OF DOING THAT JOB, I'LL BE THE FIRST ONE TO SAY, NO, SHE SHOULDN'T BE A CITY INTERIM CITY ATTORNEY. SO I WANT TO BE SURE, JUST FOR THE RECORD, THE COMPETENCE IS THERE, THE PROFESSIONALISM IS THERE, AND THE DOWNGRADE, HER ABILITY TO DO THE JOB FOR WHATEVER REASON. I JUST DON'T THINK IT'S FAIR. AND I WANT TO SAY THAT BECAUSE IF SHE HAPPENS TO GET THAT ROLE, YOU HAVE THIS CLOUD THAT SHE'S NOT CAPABLE. SHE'S MORE THAN CAPABLE OF DOING THAT JOB. I WORK WITH HER. I KNOW MORE THAN ANYONE ELSE INTIMATELY WITH KNOWLEDGE BASES. AND WE TALK A GREAT DEAL ABOUT CAREER CHOICES AND DECISIONS AND HOW PROFESSIONALISM. SO I WANT TO BE CLEAR. MISS WALLACE IS MORE THAN CAPABLE OF BEING INTERIM CITY ATTORNEY WITH THE HIGHEST LEVEL OF COMPETENCE AND INDEPENDENCE. YEAH, I WELL, I DID NOT TALK ABOUT COMPETENCE AT ALL, AND I AM NOT I'M NOT. BUT I AM TALKING ABOUT INDEPENDENCE. OKAY. BUT THIS THIS TALK THAT WE DON'T HAVE A CITY ATTORNEY, IF SHE'S THERE, I DON'T KNOW WHERE THAT'S COMING FROM. SHE'S A CITY ATTORNEY IN THE STATE OF FLORIDA. SHE'S COMPETENT, SHE'S INTELLIGENT, SHE'S EDUCATED, SHE HAS EXPERIENCE. YOU KNOW, THAT'S THAT'S I'LL LEAVE IT AT THAT. THANK YOU. COMMISSIONER SADOWSKI, A HOUSEKEEPING MATTER AND MR. CHESS YOU HAVE A SITUATION WHERE THE RISK DEPARTMENT IS IN THE CITY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE. HOWEVER, THE FOLKS IN THE RISK HAVE CHOSEN TO MOVE ON TO THEIR NEXT BEST LIFE. MY QUESTION IS, AND I DON'T KNOW HOW TO TO COUCH IT EXCEPT FOR I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT THAT BECAUSE RISK IS BASICALLY DIMINISHED AT THIS POINT THAT I DON'T KNOW WHOSE DECISION MAKING IT SHOULD BE. BUT SINCE THERE ISN'T ANYBODY IN THAT OFFICE OR WON'T BE ANYBODY IN THAT OFFICE WHEN THE RESIGNATIONS OCCUR THAT YOU WHO ARE MANAGING DEPARTMENTS SHOULD TAKE ACTION AND PLACE IT IN HR AS IN MY OPINION, FROM COMING HERE FROM SOMEWHERE ELSE SHOULD HAVE BEEN DONE A WHILE AGO, BUT I THINK TAKING RISK OUT OF THE ATTORNEY'S OFFICE WILL HELP TO DIMINISH SOME OF THE WORKLOAD IN THE ATTORNEY'S OFFICE INITIALLY. SO I, YOU KNOW, I DON'T KNOW WHO TO ASK THAT QUESTION OF OR TO BUT IS THAT SOMETHING YOU HAVE CONSIDERED, OR IS THAT SOMETHING THAT WE I THINK WE DO NEED TO CONSIDER? WELL, I, I HAVEN'T CONSIDERED THAT AS OF LATE. I THINK I BROUGHT THAT UP TO THE COMMISSION WHEN I FIRST CAME ON BOARD. IT WAS ADAMANTLY OPPOSED THAT THE CITY ATTORNEY MAKES THAT DECISION. IF IT WANTS TO GO BACK TO THE CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE, I HAVE NO PROBLEM WHATSOEVER MANAGING RISK OUT OF THE CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE, THROUGH HR OR THROUGH HR ALONE. I'VE DONE IT FOR YEARS, BUT THAT DECISION WAS MADE AND I BACKED OFF OF THAT. WHEN I FIRST CAME ON BOARD, I WAS TOLD, HEY, IT'S NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. THE CITY ATTORNEY'S DEAL, I BELIEVE IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE IN THE CITY MANAGER'S OFFICE. IT WAS AT ONE POINT IT WAS TRANSFERRED TO THE CITY ATTORNEY. SO I HAVE NO PROBLEM WHATSOEVER. TAKING ON THAT RESPONSIBILITY BECAUSE I KNOW THAT I CAN AND HAVE A COMPETENT HR MANAGER WHO CAN DO THE JOB IF I'M ASKED TO. I'M NOT ASKING IT BECAUSE I WENT DOWN THAT ROAD ALREADY. I WAS BEAT DOWN. AND MISTER CHESS, THAT ACTUALLY IS YOUR YOU ARE THE ADMINISTRATOR AND THE COMMISSION DOESN'T GET INVOLVED IN YOUR PERSONNEL DECISIONS. AND SO THAT IS SOMETHING THAT IS SO IF I'M BEING IN YOUR PURVIEW, IT'S WITHIN YOUR PURVIEW. I HAVE A PROBLEM WHATSOEVER. I'M TAKING RISKS OVER TO THEM. ON THE CITY MANAGER'S LEADERSHIP THROUGH HR. I'M ABSOLUTELY FINE WITH THAT. MR. SORENSEN, SO BUT ONE THING I WOULD LIKE TO SAY BEFORE WE VOTE, SOMETHING YOU SAID EARLIER THAT I'M CONCERNED ABOUT THAT YOU WOULD PROCEED TO GO AHEAD AND TRY TO HIRE OTHER ATTORNEYS FOR THE ATTORNEY'S OFFICE. DID YOU SAY THAT? YES, MA'AM. WHAT? I SAID WE COULD WE COULD POST THE POSITIONS AND GO AHEAD AND START THE RECRUITMENT PROCESS, KNOWING THAT WE'D HAVE TO RETRIEVE, YOU KNOW, APPLICATIONS FROM THE OUTSIDE, AND IT WOULD TAKE A PERIOD OF TIME. IN THE MEANTIME, WE'VE IDENTIFIED SOME ATTORNEYS THAT COULD BE TEMPORARY PUT INTO POSITIONS FOR AS LONG AS WE NEED THEM, AS WELL AS A PARALEGAL THAT CAN BE PUT IN THE POSITION AS LONG AS WE NEED THEM WHILE WE'RE DOING THE RECRUITMENT. I JUST WOULDN'T WHOEVER IS GOING TO BE THE NEW CITY ATTORNEY, I WOULD NOT HAVE. I AM A LITTLE CONCERNED ABOUT US HIRING ATTORNEYS THAT WORK FOR THEM. SO YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT TEMPORARY HIRING, NOT PERMANENT HIRING. IS THAT RIGHT FOR WORK IN THIS? IS THAT RIGHT? THAT IS CORRECT. WE CAN DO EITHER OR. WE CAN, WE CAN GO AHEAD AND RECRUIT OR WE CAN HOLD OFF AND GET TEMPORARY ATTORNEYS TO PUT IN THERE. WE CAN USE OUTSIDE FIRMS AS NEEDED. YOU KNOW, IF THERE'S SOMETHING THAT NEEDS TO GET CLARIFIED ON A CERTAIN DEAL, WE COULD USE UTILIZE OUTSIDE ATTORNEYS FOR THAT, JUST LIKE WE WOULD DO NOW. BUT YES, WE COULD JUST HAVE TEMPORARY ATTORNEYS AND PARALEGALS IN THERE. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. SO COMMISSIONERS, ARE YOU READY TO VOTE OR IS THERE ANY MORE DISCUSSION, MADAM MAYOR, [01:05:01] LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION TO PLACE ATTORNEY WALLACE AS THE TEMPORARY OR I GUESS WE SAID TEMPORARY, RIGHT? AS OPPOSED TO ACTING. I WANT TO MAKE SURE THE INTERIM THE INTERIM CITY ATTORNEY AS INTERIM CITY ATTORNEY. AS LAID OUT BY THE HR MANAGER DIRECTOR WITH THE PROVISIONS RECOGNIZED IN THE CITY CHARTER IN THE IN THE INTERIM, IF YOU CAN, IF IF IT'LL BE OKAY, IF YOU COULD ADD THAT I WOULD BRING BACK A CONTRACT AND A RESOLUTION FOR CITY MANAGER, CITY COMMISSION'S REVIEW. I CAN GET IT ON. I BELIEVE I CAN GET IT ON THE SEPTEMBER 8TH AGENDA AND DIRECTOR HR MANAGER TO BRING BACK A CONTRACT NEXT AVAILABLE CITY COMMISSION MEETING. IS THERE A SECOND? SECOND. ALRIGHTY. CALL THE ROLL, PLEASE. MR. BRODERICK. WELL PLAYED OUT. MY VOTE IS NO COMMISSIONER SADOWSKI. YES, MA'AM. COMMISSIONER GAINES. YES, MA'AM. COMMISSIONER JOHNSON. YES, MA'AM. MAYOR HUDSON. NO, MA'AM. OKAY. UNLESS THERE'S ANYTHING FOR THE GOOD OF THE ORDER, WE'RE GOING TO ADJOURN, AND WE WILL BE. * This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.